I need to talk to you on Skype Matt when you have time.

Ronnie,

What I want to do is understand the way you think Stan's Vic works. the important part for me is getting my head wrapped around what's happening. I'm the kind of guy that likes to watch videos and learn from them. Reading a book sometimes isn't helpful unless I do the experiment in the book myself to physically see what's going on.

So what I'm asking is continue describing the way you think stands VIC works because this thinking will help me think clearly and understand what to do next. I've been through the scenario that Matt is doing right now.

He is building and testing I've been there I've done that and I will continue doing that once I have enough information to really fully understand what I actually need to do. I have little pieces of the puzzle but I don't think I understand the whole puzzle. So yes we are actually getting a lot out of what you're doing.

For me I've looked at what you said and put a new perspective on some of the ideas and ways that Stan says stuff. It's actually been very helpful.  kind of like a new Fresh thinking on an old idea that I studied for so many years. So with that said just do what you're doing continue speaking how you understand the system and slowly one at a time through cooperation we will understand it too. I haven't asked many questions about how you're VIC works. I'm interested in how you understand stands Vic and how to tune it and the parameters that need to be correct.

In my perspective there is a really big list of things that have to be just right for this system to function correctly I know this because some of the things you speak of I've already achieved and I've seen in my own lab however there was a few things that weren't correct which did not allow me to successfully tune the VIC.  So for me I need to have all the pieces so I can think about them the way you think about Stan's VIC so I can move forward. This is just how my brain works. I don't want to start testing anything yet,  I want to understand everything so I can tune and build everything correctly.

I have a lot to learn but I also understand a lot and I know the things that need to be done to achieve this goal however there are things that I still don't understand of which one little piece at a time you would help all of us understand.

keep going. we are learning...

~Russ

Anytime you and Matt would like to do a skype call, i'm all in for it to help people understand the coupling of the coils. I just don't think anyone is getting anything out of what I'm saying. Maybe you two guy's can put it into words people can understand.

Well one things for sure. We will do what we can to help you help others.

We all here are smart people. And theirs the problem. We are people. We all learn different. We are all at different stages of our learning. So what you say now may not make much sense to some people. But in the future they get to the stage where like " oh yeah that's what Ronnie was trying to tell me"

So for the now or the future.

Just keep going.

~Russ

Quote from ~Russ on November 10th, 2016, 07:03 PM

We are all at different stages of our learning. So what you say now may not make much sense to some people. But in the future they get to the stage where like " oh yeah that's what Ronnie was trying to tell me"

Yeap.  And now I know why we have been making a mountain out of mole hill.  Ronnie is 100% correct, this isn't difficult if you actually know where you are trying to go and forget all the chaff that doesn't matter.

We'll get together and put some information out here people can make sense of.

In the meantime, everyone brush-up on electrostatics.  You'll need this in order to go any further with Stan Meyer technology.

You guys are right...It's difficult because we all have our strong and weak points of understanding.

Over the years many people have posted 'Stan's secret, including myself....then I realized what I thought was the secret was common knowledge for others....and vise versa.

Thanks Matt for the good discussion on Skype tonight, It helped out a lot just to get someone to understand what I been trying to say to everyone. :thumbsup:

Quote from HMS-776 on November 10th, 2016, 07:47 PM

You guys are right...It's difficult because we all have our strong and weak points of understanding.

Over the years many people have posted 'Stan's secret, including myself....then I realized what I thought was the secret was common knowledge for others....and vise versa.

Brad there is only one secret to Stan Meyers, If you figure out how to turn off the the bond that holds the two molecules together then you will know the secret.

One day at a time.

Ronnie
I understand all what you said. Please keep explaining .
thank
andy

First prototype.

Coils wound to the specs seen here and positioned as Ronnie has shown us.


After talking with Ronnie earlier, please guys, ditch the dual-core concept for the time being.  It's is not needed, more complicated and different enough from Stan's original setup that it will only cause confusion to even talk about it.  Once you have mastered Stan's original VIC, then you can pursue all sorts of hybrid type circuits.

If I hadn't stayed up all night and sliced my fingers making the bobbins, I would probably hook up a driver circuit and show more, but for now, it's time to KISS it good night.

 :offtobed:

One other thing to read and ponder--the attached PDF.  I think you will find it helpful as Ronnie proceeds.

Looking good Matt, Get some sleep and rest.

I will study electrostatics more as you guys suggest. And seeing as ronnie wants theory before any practical i will try to have all theory done before i ask further questions.  Or build anything

Quote from mercury101 on November 11th, 2016, 05:45 AM

I will study electrostatics more as you guys suggest. And seeing as ronnie wants theory before any practical i will try to have all theory done before i ask further questions.  Or build anything

It's not that I don't want people to build anything I want people to understand what they are building, so they can teach others. I built this once and had no clue what I built and could not answer not one question that was ask of me if I had to, of how I got it to work. I just don't want people to be in the same shape I was in when I got it to work the first time. As far as asking question, I'm all for that! It's like Russ and others have stated, people are at different phases in all this, but what we all can agree to, is everyone is stuck at whatever phase they are in. If people wants to know the end results of all this no matter what phase they are in it's this: It's not just placing a charge on each plate, It how to control the charges on the plates in order to break the bond of the water molecule. The Vic together with the water fuel cell does this, but without knowing how every part of the Vic and water fuel cell works, no one will be able to get it to work, unless it's by luck.

I know Mr. Ronnie. I understand why you want people to understand it first efore they start. I will try my best and figure out what you and Matt and Ris and others already know. I will e quiet for now because i dont want to take up space that someone else further along than me needs help. I will try to get a full grasp of what i need to study before asking further questions. That way less painfull for you or anyone else here. Lol. I dont want to be responsible for bald patches on the side of anyones head from pulling their hair out! Lol.  Matt attached the doc of electrostatics i will read that and i will go back to your coil formulas also and calculate that all out. I will re read the posts here to clarify how to do the math and try it.
But because shipping takes a while can I ask this: what gauge wire do you recommend 29 was before and tripple coted was prefered. I sometimes see 28 and 30 more common and easier to get. Just wondering if 29 is most desired i will order as it will take a while to get to me.  I know i will be making mistakes and many coils so I will order a large spool. 
I will work on the theory before winding a coil i promise.  I do want to understand this inside out and backwards because onfe I know it that well then i can help others.

Merc

Quote from gpssonar on November 11th, 2016, 07:14 AM

It's not I don't want people to build anything I want people to understand what they are building, so they can teach others. I built this once and had no clue what I built and could not answer not one question that was ask of me if I had to, of how I got it to work. I just don't want people to be in the same shape I was in when I got it to work the first time. As far as asking question, I'm all for that! It's like Russ and others have stated, people are at different phases in all this, but what we all can agree to, is everyone is stuck at whatever phase they are in. If people wants to know the end results of all this no matter what phase they are in it's this: It's not just placing a charge on each plate, It how to control the charges on the plates in order to break the bond of the water molecule. The Vic together with the water fuel cell does this, but without knowing how every part of the Vic and water fuel cell works, no one will be able to get it to work, unless it's by luck.

29 gauge is the best it has a 1.2 amp rating, since we need 1 amp. 30 gauge is under rated it is only good for .86 amps. So a balance between 28 and 30 gauge is 29 gauge if you can get it. If you can't get 29 gauge I would shoot for 28 gauge for it has a amp rating of 1.4 amps.

Quote from ~Russ on November 10th, 2016, 09:27 AM

knowing and working are 2 different things :)

~Russ

Im always working on something
https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/photo/111028537414402963474/6351750170659622226?icm=false

That's what it takes Ris, understanding things and getting it right. It will all pay off in the long run.

Quote from gpssonar on November 11th, 2016, 08:47 AM

29 gauge is the best it has a 1.2 amp rating, since we need 1 amp. 30 gauge is under rated it is only good for .86 amps. So a balance between 28 and 30 gauge is 29 gauge if you can get it. If you can't get 29 gauge I would shoot for 28 gauge for it has a amp rating of 1.4 amps.

Thanks. I can get 29 and tripple coated I was told.  But need to buy a bigger spool is all. Its ok i will go for that. Thank you for the answer. Also i will buy glyptol to further insulate coils once wire coil size and configuration is all calculated out. That will help increase integrity of coil and rigidity as well as insulation value.  First thing first is math.  I just want to have things ready for next step when i am solid on theory.
thanks.

Quote from Ris on November 11th, 2016, 08:50 AM

Im always working on something
https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/photo/111028537414402963474/6351750170659622226?icm=false

nice work Ris, is that an iron laminated core?

i'm doing the same but in my head first lol i need ti there before i can do it with my hands :)

funny thing is is i did everything to the point where i dont need to take measurements, i have them all in my spreed sheet lol
 but again, the next build will need to be measured ect, but for now i continue to do it in my head. i cant take a photos of that lol

im getting there!!

spend way in to the night making my self understand it. more to do but a HUGE jump in my understanding. the next step is to make sure its corect by doing the math to check it... 

~Russ

Quote from mercury101 on November 11th, 2016, 08:57 AM

First thing first is math.  I just want to have things ready for next step when i am solid on theory.
thanks.

this is where im at too, i think its the right way to go, however as i put it oll on the table... i have a lot of experience already with the components and there reactions so im just trying to use my already measured coils and components and do the math on them to see if it's all matching up to my understanding...

~Russ

bottom line of my transformer he contains knowledge-therefore I took classical laminated cores from an old transformer lying around cost 0$

Quote from Ris on November 11th, 2016, 09:41 AM

bottom line of my transformer he contains knowledge-therefore I took classical laminated cores from an old transformer lying around cost 0$

nice!!

you can compare those to my solid " iron" core...

might be helpful , would be good for people to start to full this stuff out! im the only one who ever put stuff in this sheet but there is a page labeled  " place your info here"

so when you get your data let me know, i can add it to the main spreed sheet...

sheet

i think its important to have a global measurements sheet.. this way we can help each other...

~Russ

"My dual core setup has up to 5 adjustment on it not including the coils just with gaps and spacing. So how is anyone going to understand that if they don't understand Stan's?"

Thats what i thought,the 2 core vic being 10times more complex than Stans vic.No wonder i could not get anything out of that setup...I will trow that in the garbage tomorow,after  countless hours of frustration,seing 12v on the output no matter what i did,polishing the cores by hand to fit the bobins...etc etc...and not build anything before i have the proper core.Ronnie i dont know others but i learn and understand beter when i test and build something.I test something and when i read and learn i understand where and why i got wrong...Reading theories about a transformer that i will built after 1 year or two or never(because the frikin core)would get me no were.Its like in school if you learn for example ohm's law without building a circuit and learning the same time after 2 days you forget it entirely.No offense to no one but I'm more a technical guy and thats  only my point of view.

Ady15, don't throw it in the garbage, Just put the primary close to the secondary and you will see a increase in voltage. That's the only way the primary will couple with the secondary. You only wasted time because you don't know how it is coupled. That's what I been trying to teach here for the last 5 pages. Just watch this video of Don's he shows moving a coil close to one another even without a core in either of the coils. As you can see they couple together when they are moved close to one another. So just try putting the primary and secondary close together in your setup. I bet you will see a voltage increase.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2mT_RAyJm0