Took me a while to find this, but here is all the information you should ever need if you are working with Essex Magnet Wire:
https://www.superioressex.com/uploadedFiles/Magnet_Wire_and_Distribution/North_America/Magnet_Wire_-_Winding_Wire/EngData_book_linked.pdf

Good information Matt, I'll pickup where I left off after the election tonight.

Quote from gpssonar on November 8th, 2016, 02:20 PM

Good information Matt, I'll pickup where I left off after the election tonight.

10-4.   Here's a pretty good link to keep open in your browser before things start to clog up:
http://www.politico.com/2016-election/results/map/president


And when this presidential reality show is over, I have question about wire sizes and cores.  As I posted earlier, if you wind this VIC step-up in reverse (larger wire size secondary than primary), I get all sorts of combinations that seem to work.  So my next curiosity to tackle is what is an optimal capacitance/inductance ratio?

BTW, got my new ferrite cores today.  They're monsters and if utilized properly, they should allow one to make a VIC capable of powering an aircraft carrier.   :)

Mr. Matt.
How much were the cores?

Also i found a 0 to 100 c  chart of dialetric of water but not sure how to post the pdf here. Perhaps i dont have that privaledge. If i send the link can you check it and if worth while to post can you post it Mr. Matt?

Quote from gpssonar on November 8th, 2016, 02:20 PM

Good information Matt, I'll pickup where I left off after the election tonight.

I take it your as worried as I am about the election...

Quote from HMS-776 on November 8th, 2016, 05:13 PM

I take it your as worried as I am about the election...

I'm much more worried about being hauled off and dropped on the moon by an extraterrestrial.

Simple words of wisdom...

Focus your energy on the things you have some semblance of control over, like making a Stan Meyer VIC & WFC.  That is something you will never forget.  When you're old and your mind is about gone, you may not be able to replicate what you did in your youth, but you will always know, that once, back in years, you did it.

Quote from mercury101 on November 8th, 2016, 04:00 PM

How much were the cores?

$17.38 plus shipping per half core.

Quote from mercury101 on November 8th, 2016, 04:05 PM

Also i found a 0 to 100 c  chart of dialetric of water but not sure how to post the pdf here. Perhaps i dont have that privaledge. If i send the link can you check it and if worth while to post can you post it Mr. Matt?

PM me the link and I'll post it.

Quote from mercury101 on November 8th, 2016, 04:05 PM

Also i found a 0 to 100 c  chart of dialetric of water but not sure how to post the pdf here.

Done.   Pretty interesting circuit that describes how the measurements were made.

Hy guys i know a company from Poland that sells electronic components worldwide and they has numerous types of ferrite cores.Here is a link and the closest to Stans vic size core that i could find in that list.open the pdf datasheet and you will see that is 80% close to Stans vic.the name is
FERROXCUBE U93/76/16-3C90

And link http://www.tme.eu/gb/katalog/#id_category=112517&s_field=artykul&s_order=ASC&visible_params=2%2C74%2C139%2C236%2C459%2C1362%2C1382%2C1382&used_params=1382%3A373465%3B&page=1&currency=USD

This one would be perfect but i cannot find any site that sells it.just a russian site but its complicated..
https://www.google.ro/search?q=ur93%5C80%5C30&biw=320&bih=498&prmd=mivn&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiy3NK7_5rQAhXJCsAKHcOWDc44FBD8BQgGKAI&dpr=1.5#imgrc=wwja1XssVU02vM%3A

Ronnie please advice if thats ok

Hi Guys..If matt bought that huge (Trump Wins) core there about $65.00-$75.00 . I still think there to large to work right but what do I know.

Quote from HHO-Dan on November 8th, 2016, 11:40 PM

I still think there to large to work right but what do I know.

We really need to know if this thing will scale or if it can really only be one size.   I'd like to find some sort of sweet spot where the coils are easy to wind, the unit is pretty rugged and easy to tune to typical plate cells people may have laying around.  If it will fuel your 15kW house genset, all the more better.  :)

Quote from HHO-Dan on November 7th, 2016, 03:18 AM

About 1000v+..after C1 charges there is no longer a load to hold the feild on L1 and it will discharge into C1
Got to get something right.....
Note: GPS Twin core bobbins all cleaned up now time to make a new cell I lost my tubes from last year!
Sorry for being grumpy last night guys just wish I had 1 solid number for the twin core.

Dan, apparently your the only one why cares about this Question i asked. ( or so it seemed)
so thank you for responding,

i ask this question because when Ronnie gets to explaining the diode, i think this simple idea will come in to play.

it just shows you the effects of a charging inductor and cap. using a DC source, and the effect of the Diode.

the inducter is like a fly wheel, so once the switch is closed you get the flywheel going and once the potental is = to the sorce, the "flywheel" dose not want to stop. so it keeps its momentum and gives even more than the supply delivered.

the voltage is Double  the input. this works with out the diode as well. but what the diode dose is KEEP that voltage in the cap, this is an important thing to remember.

i just thought this was extremely relevant and if everyone here has already seen this or knows this, well good lol but i wanted to post it anyway.

its thses simple things, knowing what each part dose of the system...

~Russ

PS, good job Dan, you were right!

Sorry I didn't chime in to your question, I got involved in our election process, and put this aside a few days. Anyway I am back now ready to continue on. You are right about the inductor and capacitor creating a flywheel effect. I will talk about the diode, but first I have something else i want to talk about first about the Vic.

GPS
Can you share details of your setup - (vic and water cell) with us to replicate it , please?
Andy

Quote from andy on November 9th, 2016, 11:46 AM

GPS
Can you share details of your setup - (vic and water cell) with us to replicate it , please?
Andy

Andy, one part at a time, thats what he is doing...  :)

~Russ

Let's talk about the coupling of the coils. In Stan's drawing he shows the coupling for the Magnetic field of the coils with the cores. Even though the primary and feedback and secondary is not in the right places (His drawings are a little confusing) according to his real VIC even though it still shows the magnetic coupling. If you arrange everything the way the actual Vic is you will see the Primary and L2 choke is 100% coupled and the Secondary and L1 choke is 100% coupled. So you may say what couples the Primary to the Secondary and L1 to L2? Answer is the gap between the cores. I also placed a second drawing below that shows them in the correct order, excluding the feedback coil. As we all know with a gap between the cores and the primary and secondary and L1 and L2 being on cores of there own, they can't be 100% coupled no matter how close you get them together. So in my opinion the gap between the cores is for a variable magnetic field to couple the primary and secondary and L1 and L2 together. Question: If we have a variable magnetic field that brings the Primary and Secondary together, what can be varied in the secondary by having a lose coupling or a tight coupling? Also what can be varied by having a lose or tight coupling between L1 and L2? Or does this variable coupling matter at all?

My 2c: A variable gap leaves the ability to either strengthen or to weaken the magnetic field induced by the primary, which indirectly then should be inducing a current to the secondary coil(s) depending on the gap distance, which could mean that by using a variable gap the voltage in the secondary coils can also be varied.
I'm probably wrong though, but whatever.

I also think that voltage is controled by the primary/secoundary coupling but also the inductances of the 4 coils

Ady15, if all the coils has a piece of core in them already the inductance can not be change, unless you move the core in and out of the coil which that is not the case here. The only thing that can change the inductance of the coils is the AL value of the core material. This is why this needs to be discussed, I think they are other people that thinks the way Ady15 does.

Quote from gpssonar on November 9th, 2016, 12:11 PM

Let's talk about the coupling of the coils. In Stan's drawing he shows the coupling for the Magnetic field of the coils with the cores. Even though the primary and feedback and secondary is not in the right places (His drawings are a little confusing) according to his real VIC even though it still shows the magnetic coupling. If you arrange everything the way the actual Vic is you will see the Primary and L2 choke is 100% coupled and the Secondary and L1 choke is 100% coupled. So you may say what couples the Primary to the Secondary and L1 to L2? Answer is the gap between the cores. I also placed a second drawing below that shows them in the correct order, excluding the feedback coil. As we all know with a gap between the cores and the primary and secondary and L1 and L2 being on cores of there own, they can't be 100% coupled no matter how close you get them together. So in my opinion the gap between the cores is for a variable magnetic field to couple the primary and secondary and L1 and L2 together. Question: If we have a variable magnetic field that brings the Primary and Secondary together, what can be varied in the secondary by having a lose coupling or a tight coupling? Also what can be varied by having a lose or tight coupling between L1 and L2? Or does this variable coupling matter at all?

I don´t agree to primary and L2 100% coupled because 100% coupling only takes place if the whole magnetic path is directed thru the ferrite.

imagine primary and L2 on a ferrite rod ... there is a huge gap around the rod and no direct coupling.



if you take away half of the core and leave primary and L2 on a core half then the magnetic field will be asymetric but it still remains an open core (like a bent rod).

Yes Gunther you are correct, but as we all know both cores is together whether tight or lose coupled but they are coupled. So therefor the whole magnetic path is directed thru the ferrite. So therefor they are 100% coupled.

Looks like it is experiment time:
1: Place a Primary coil and a L2 coil on a rod, pulse the primary and take measurements on L2.
2: Place a Primary coil on one rod and a L2 on another rod side beside and pulse the primary and take measurements on L2 while moving the coils away from each other horizontally and back again.
3: Place a Primary coil on one rod and L2 on another rod and put them in front of each other and pulse the Primary and take measurement of L2 while moving the coils vertically from each other and back again.
4: Place a Primary coil and L2 coil on one core and place another core like in Stan's so the magnetic path is directed around the cores and pulse the Primary and take measurements of L2, move the gap back and forth and take measurements.

Do your own experiments don't take my word for anything,
That's what solves problems.
It may take a little time to do experiments, but it will put facts in your mind that you can see for yourself.

Ronnie, this can get a little hairy as demonstrated by Naudin's Delayed Lenz Effect experiments.
http://jnaudin.free.fr/dlenz/indexen.htm

Positioning of the bobbin on the core is (can be) responsible for the phase shift you talked about earlier.  Luc (gotoluc) Choquette and Brad (TinManPower) did extensive experiments with this phenomena.

If this is something that is needed in the VIC, God help us getting it correct.  It is very difficult, requiring exact core specifications, winding parameters, positioning and frequency adjustment.  And once someone gets this correct, it has to match up with the impedance matching formulas you talked about earlier.  Lots of variables that have to be spot-on.

Matt, this is not a big variable at all. Just trying to get people to understand the gap of the cores and what effect it has. The main important thing here is what effect does the gap have on the primary and Secondary. It is just common since what the Primary and L2 and the secondary and L2 does and how they work.

Try this as an experiment:
1: Take a primary coil and place it on one core like in Stan's and place the secondary on the other coil pulse the primary coil and move the gap back and forth at different gap distances and take measurements of the secondary. See if changes voltage or what!

They are so many different opinions on this, and that is why I can't just tell them and get anyone to believe in what I say. So you will have to do all these experiments yourself and see what takes place on your own. Hell they are some people thinks the gap, stores energy, controls core saturation, some thinks it changes inductance and some thinks it's is a spark gap. LOL