Matt, do you have a post somewhere explaining the universal switch you talked about earlier?

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Instead use a setup like my Universal Switch with two transistors, each having protection diodes so the transistors are safe but when the switch is off, it's off just like a mechanical switch.

More discussions about timing because timing is just about everything.

The new commutator has essentially fixed timing of fire -> short -> open.  There is a small open gap between fire and short.  The full revolution consists of two fire -> short -> open cycles, one for each polarity.

Well, certainly the RPM may change but the base timing with respect to commutator angle is fixed.

Some things to ponder:

If you have the current vs. time plot for the batteries energizing the coil without the motor running, then you can compare that with the current vs. time plot when the motor is running during the fire cycle.  You should see less current during the fire cycle because we know that the motoring action induces an EMF inside the big coil that acts to reduce the current flow.  And it is this EMF times the current flow that represents the the power that is exported to the outside world that pushes on the rotor.

The DSO is very sophisticated.  I am going to assume that it can do math functions on a subset of a captured waveform.  If you line up two cursors to the start and end of the fire pulse, you should be able to measure the total electrical energy put into the pulse.  Also, with box-car sampling you get more precise data to work with.  You also should be able to measure the RMS current between the two cursors, and that RMS current times the resistance of the coil gives you the energy burned off as resistive losses during the fire pulse.

We know the magnitude of the current flow at the end of the pulse, and we know the inductance of the coil, therefore we can calculate the amount of final magnetic energy in the coil at the end of the fire pulse.

Then presumably we can calculate the amount of energy in the fire pulse that gets imparted onto the rotor which is:   Rotor pulse energy =  (total energy - resistive loss energy - final magnetic energy).

The above is not 100% certain, I have some concerns about the interaction between the magnetic field of the rotor and the amount of final magnetic energy in the coil at the end of the fire pulse.  There may be other effects that come into play.  But certainly the framework is there.

Then of course you have two fire pulses per revolution and you know the RPM of the rotor.  That means you can calculate the average mechanical power put into the rotor as it spins at a given RPM.  That power gets burnt off in the bearings and in the air friction.

Here is what would be a small measurement victory:   You tweak the motor and get a higher RPM and your rotor pulse energy measurement and the average mechanical power calculation shows an increase when the motor is running at a higher RPM.

Timing analysis and energy analysis - this is what it's all about.

SS

Now, a discussion about the shorting cycle.

For starters, there is a small open gap between the fire cycle and the shorting cycle.  Presumably you will get a plasma burn here and there will be a drop in the current flow through the big coil due to the plasma burn.  Knowing the big coil inductance and the coil resistance and the current drop you can measure the resistive losses in the coil during the plasma burn and the amount of energy lost in the plasma burn itself.

So then we have the shorting cycle.  If you can rotate the rotate the rotor by hand at say 120 RPM without the battery connected you can measure both the open-circuit EMF produced by the big coil and also measure the short-circuit current flow through the big coil.  Presumably at this low frequency they are directly related by the resistance of the coil itself, but this could be checked.  Then once you have that data it is all proportional to the RPM so you can easily deduce it at higher and lower RPMs.   The whole point is to get some baseline data for EMF vs. angle and current vs. angle.

So there is a big question about the shorting cycle.  The purpose of the shorting cycle is to continue pushing on the rotor with the recycling current that is flowing through the coil.  But what if the recycling current has decayed to zero before the shorting cycle has completed?  Well, then obviously there is still going to be current flowing through the coil because of the induction from the spinning rotor.  When this happens the rotor is acting as a generator and the "load" is the resistance of the big coil.  This means that there will be a drag on the rotor slowing it down.

So, clearly there may be both coil discharging effects pushing on the rotor and rotor generator effects putting a drag on the rotor all within the time of the shorting cycle.  Naturally this will all be dependent on the length of the shorting cycle which is dependent on the RPM of the rotor.  A big clue will be the measurement of the current flowing through the coil during the shorting cycle.  Does it look like the coil is discharging its stored energy from the fire pulse, or does it look like current being induced in the coil from the rotating rotor magnet?  Does one process seamlessly transition into the other process?  Or does the rotor turn fast enough such that the only thing taking place is that the coil is discharging some stored energy from the fire pulse and giving the rotor a push?   And you can't forget that during this whole cycle there are still resistive losses in the coil based on the RMS current flow through the big coil during the time period of the shorting cycle.

So, does the shorting cycle just give a push on the rotor, or does it start with a push and then transition to a drag?  And of course all of this depends on the RPM of the rotor.

So as you can see, you can't necessarily take the shorting cycle for granted.  One more time, it's a question of understanding the timing and energy analysis of the shorting cycle.

SS

Quote from Brad on February 23rd, 2018, 04:03 AM

Matt, do you have a post somewhere explaining the universal switch you talked about earlier?

http://open-source-energy.org/?topic=1851.0

Quote from Matt Watts on February 21st, 2018, 07:52 PM

Russ, I need you to put an experiment on your list of "To-Dos"...

Its kinda been on the list... will get to it soon enough. i think... now that the pulse is working. ( for the most part)
~Russ

https://youtu.be/LG9ZIJRFzlE
~Russ

Augmentation.  Understanding how this happens in a pulse motor is key.  What it means in simple terms though is typical Lens Law is no longer part of the equation.  What you see on the scope is the current draw from the batteries drops, which could seem to be a good thing, but you have to ask yourself these questions:  Is the current dropping because the motor is requesting less power draw?  Or, is the current dropping because the motor is feeding itself?  The answer is both.  The motor is actually providing a potential of higher voltage than the batteries with current in the correct phase, hence it no longer needs the current from the batteries and the battery current drops.

Now think consumption for a moment.  If the motor initially draws a lot of current, then rolls off, the motor must be producing not only higher voltage than the batteries, but also a lot of current.  So once you have augmentation working for you, the next step is to increase consumption.  From there your only limit is keeping the motor from burning itself up.


Lots of nice research going on Russ.  I hope the electronically controlled mechanical switching reveals something of great importance.  I think it will because you can tailor the switching to work with the coil.  A fully mechanical setup simply may not gravitate towards the optimal RPM and as such, not really show us what the motor is capable of.

things in motion do not require additional power input
stationary things apparently in the zero state do not possess any kinetic energy
common sense says We run through space and time almost 1 000 000 km/h
your job is to find an outlet and take some of that power although we already do it for several millennia
Conservation of energy are only measuring illusion that is sometimes helpful.

Space-time is the illusion; space-spin is the reality.

Revenge of the flywheel analogy.  A spinning flywheel is a perfect analogy for an inductor.  It's also a perfect analogy for a capacitor but that's another discussion.

Nobody could explain why the current draw of the coil goes down when the coil makes the rotor move.  Let's use the flywheel analogy to explain it.

As a reminder the torque that you apply to the flywheel, or the torque that the flywheel applies to you, is the voltage.  The RPM of the flywheel is the current.  When the flywheel is free spinning with no resistance that's equivalent to a short-circuit across the coil.  When the flywheel is locked tight so that it can't move, that's the equivalent of an open-circuit (a very very high resistance) across the coil.

Imagine a flywheel setup on a vertical axis.  Let's say the flywheel itself is about the size and shape of a 40-pound barbell weight and it's about waist height.  Above the flywheel there is a place on the shaft where you can wind a leather strap around the shaft.  You pull on the leather strap to spin up the flywheel.  At the end of the pull the leather strap releases and the flywheel spins on its bearings.

So, you wind the leather strap around the shaft, give it a good hard yank, and the flywheel ends up spinning at a certain RPM.  Let's say for the sake of argument it's 100 RPM.

In this situation, you are acting like the battery.  You using your muscle power yank on the leather strap and give the flywheel a pulse of torque and the flywheel responds by going from zero RPM to 100 RPM.

So what about when the pulsed coil pushes on the rotor magnet and the final current draw of the coil is lower as compared to no push on the rotor magnet?

Now we have to come up with an analogy for pushing on the rotor magnet.   The answer to that is on the flywheel shaft there is also a brake mechanism and by adjusting the pressure on the brakes we simulate the pushing on the rotor magnet.

This time when you pull on the leather strap there is resistance of the flywheel changing speed because of its inertia and there is the additional resistance of the braking mechanism.  So this time it's harder for you to pull on the strap and you can only get the flywheel up to 80 RPM as opposed to 100 RPM with no brake applied.

So there is your explanation for the final current level in the coil going down when the coil does work to push on the rotor.  (Or more precisely the battery does the work.)

And you notice that it's harder to pull on the strap with the brake applied, and that's because the "counter EMF" from the applied brake is embedded in the resistance that you feel when you pull on the leather strap - just like there is an embedded counter EMF inside the coil when the magnetic field from the coil is pushing on the rotor magnet and doing work by making the rotor magnet move.

SS

So, if you can create a perfect mechanical analogy for a coil, and you can also create a mechanical analogy for pushing on the rotor magnet to make it move, it now begs the question:  Is it possible to create a mechanical analogy for a complete Newman motor including things like the high-voltage ring-downs associated with the self-resonance of the coil?

And the answer to that question is yes.  High-voltage self-resonance of the coil?  Go up to a big church bell and hit it with a big metal sledge hammer and see what you get.

Found it Russ!

You will easily see the magnetic field change in and around a conductor when you pass a current through it correct?

The gap between turns of wire acts as a capacitor right?

Did you know this capacitor, even though there isn't any direct conductor, also changes the magnetic field?

And guess what?

In your big coil this field direction from the displacement current is at 90 degrees to the conductor's magnetic field.  There's where your series resonance is coming from, your RF.

Surprise, surprise.  No wonder it interacts with your rotor.


I have a strong hunch if you would have wound your coil bifilar, this series SRF would be many times lower because the capacitance would be much larger.  And...   If you happened to hit on just the right combination where the series SRF was a harmonic of the parallel SRF, well..., big, big things would happen.


Think about this for a while, then go back and update your Newman document.  This is vitally important.

SS

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Nobody could explain why the current draw of the coil goes down when the coil makes the rotor move.  Let's use the flywheel analogy to explain it.

Oh good grief I could have explained it to you 30 years ago because it is standard induction theory. First the coil produces an expanding magnetic field and pushes the PM away. The PM also has a magnetic field which appears to be contracting because the PM is moving away from the coil. Any time a magnetic field "changes" it induces an Electro-Motive-Force in the coil thus in our case we have two magnetic field changes. 1) the expanding coil magnetic field due to the coil current produced by the applied emf and 2) the contracting magnetic field from the PM moving away which induces an emf in the coil in the opposite direction which some call a Cemf. In fact both are an Emf in reality which happen to be in opposite directions and an emf is an emf regardless of it's direction of force.

To recap the moving PM field induces a emf counter to the applied emf which is why the applied current decreases. So I do understand why the current draw of the coil goes down and your assumption that nobody understood is false... so stop repeating nonsense.

Now that were done with your preschool version of induction let's ask some real questions.
1) It is supposed that a magnetic field has magical lines of force closed on themselves which cannot cross one another... so how can the PM field induce a Cemf in the coil if the coil is already immersed in the closed lines of the applied magnetic field?.

2) If all magnetic fields lines are closed on themselves then how can one magnet field couple and attract another magnetic field?. They clearly show the lines joining on attraction in our models so are the field lines open or are they closed?... better yet are the lines simply a form of notation and nonexistent in reality?.

3)If we have two emf's in a coil conductor because a permanent magnet is moving away from the coil, one applied and one counter to the applied, then could we produce an emf counter to the supposed counter emf?... how many emf's can be present in one instant?, where do they apply?. What is their relationship with one another and how many ways can they interact?.

4) if the emf due to the self-induction of a coil is counter to the applied emf and the induced emf due to the magnet moving away is also counter to the applied emf then could we not have two counter emf's opposing the applied emf?... would there be a current flow?, in what direction? under what circumstances and at what time during the process?.

You see it doesn't take a rocket scientist to deduce the average understanding of conventional theory is so full of contradictions it verges on the totally absurd. I can tear it apart without even breaking a sweat because when we start asking the right questions, intelligent questions, the whole thing just falls flat on it's face. So no... the interactions between fields of force are not like a flywheel with a leather strap and a friction brake which may very well be the most incoherent analogy I have ever read.

Electro-Motive-Force... the electrical intensity within a specific region of space which acts on and applies a force on particle/fields within the volume of said space. When the particle/fields are motive or move due to the electric force we call this an electric current which produces another field of force we call a magnetic Field.

Very simple... let's not confuse the issue with nonsensical analogies.

Maybe it's time for a new narrative here rather than everything is the same-same thing just like a mechanical thing and we all know that it can never give us extra energy thus it's stupid to even try. This is not the grade school lectures on electricity thread this is the let's make Joseph Newman's motor work thread so we can prevent a god damn global disaster thread.

So I have a suggestion for Russ... if a post does not add new information or a new perspective to the narrative of making this motor work as Joseph Newman claimed it did then the post should be moved to another thread. What would happen if every post must move the conversation forward closer to our goal rather than back in time?.  What would happen if the narrative was to succeed and every conversation was designed to further that common goal?.  Progress I think... and at the end of the day that is what matters and not 200 years of conventional thinking which has brought us one step closer to destroying this planet and extinction. If it ain't working then it ain't working gentlemen and repeating the same old things ain't going to cut it in my books.

Approved.  I'll be adding more here soon as I get it.  More testing I have been doing.  Timming is hard.

~Russ

Well, based upon my formal nuclear physics education and my autodidactic education in quantum mechanics, quantum field theory, quantum electrodynamics, quantum chromodynamics and stochastic electrodynamics, I'll stick with what I said prior... you'll get excess energy out of the machine if it's timed properly due to the simple fact that orbiting electrons in the permanent magnet which have their orbital momentum stolen (and hence their orbital radius reduced) will gain energy from the quantum vacuum to regain their original orbital radius.

Russ, you'd do well to monitor permanent magnet temperature... when you hit that sweet spot, it'll show cooling.

Random thoughts experiment.

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cycle

I'll stick with what I said prior... you'll get excess energy out of the machine if it's timed properly due to the simple fact that orbiting electrons in the permanent magnet which have their orbital momentum stolen (and hence their orbital radius reduced) will gain energy from the quantum vacuum to regain their original orbital radius.

Timing is the dynamic. Every conventional motor has its optimum. The timing affects capacitance resistance and induction. If the ideal balance is achieved in the system...

Thought on the commutation.. if the brushes are contacting the surface or slight gap brushless. A carbon streak is ok but those burns.. or stray arcs.

The stray arcs represent an erratic over resistance to current (possibly). Erratic from cycle imbalance.

What would happen if the arc section on the blank of the commutator is in a shielded inert gas like argon used in welding or a vacuum?

Can there be a miniature vacuum tube for the resistance less arc in the blank space?

Can overload be dumped, saved, or fused at that point?

What would happen if the whole commutator was in a vacuum or space;
would it tend to have characteristics of a superconducting super capacitor?       

       

The JWN might actually need some level of resistance for the back EMF from the coil but there should be an optimal controller for balance and timing in an imperfect tolerance.

Quote from ~Russ on February 26th, 2018, 05:05 PM

We are chalanging the 200 years of thoughts to go back and make sence of what was happening back then as currently things arnt on the same track ~Russ

2 RUSs
~

Electrical machines, invented in the eighteenth century, are instruments for generating static electricity. Electrostatic generators were among the most important instruments in scientific laboratories of the eighteenth and nineteenth centuries. They are classified into frictional electrical machines and induction electrical machines depending on the electrification process employed.
https://catalogue.museogalileo.it/indepth/ElectricalMachine.html



TO RUSs
~
http://open-source-energy.org/?topic=3128.msg48534#msg48534

Quote from talisman on February 27th, 2018, 12:04 AM

Random thoughts experiment.

Timing is the dynamic. Every conventional motor has its optimum. The timing affects capacitance resistance and induction. If the ideal balance is achieved in the system...

Thought on the commutation.. if the brushes are contacting the surface or slight gap brushless. A carbon streak is ok but those burns.. or stray arcs.

The stray arcs represent an erratic over resistance to current (possibly). Erratic from cycle imbalance.

What would happen if the arc section on the blank of the commutator is in a shielded inert gas like argon used in welding or a vacuum?

Can there be a miniature vacuum tube for the resistance less arc in the blank space?

Can overload be dumped, saved, or fused at that point?

What would happen if the whole commutator was in a vacuum or space;
would it tend to have characteristics of a superconducting super capacitor?

That's right. 

My relay baink can be put in inert gas. 

Also funny enugh me and Richard were talking about using a vacume tube as a spark gap or even using relay vacume tubes. 

I like vacume tubes Becuse there pure analog.  And quite robust for some applications.  Such as this. 

And I agree with you.  All those varibals are verry important.  This is mainaly why I went to the relay switcher. 

~Russ

Good stuff on the thought wave.

One thought,  is the resistance from the arc a big influence on the EMF in phase during the blank?
I think the positive and negative sides have the most EMF but the blank spark gap might possibly have the momentary back pressure
on current (from visualization).

Not to get too much ahead but could a type of vacuum tube have a conductive shell instead of non conductive glass with the transfer to the brush
over it and with what  effects intended or unintended on the machine?

The relay switcher a relay good way to harvest the burst of arc energy.

   

There are a lot of options for vacuum tubes.

Currently, using relays we are limited to the switching time of the relay. In fact in my testing so far the turn off and turn on time change. as the spring tension versus the magnet field pulling the contact over is different.

The on time is about 1.7ms for my relays. and the off time is about 8ms.
so i'm limited to about 10 ms cycle time. i can get faster using resonance of the relay bounce and " bounce" the contacts back and forth to make it faster. but i'm stuck with that frequency.

also dont forget, I'm using banks of relays to do the trick. Using many smaller contacts over space to emanate the waist spark . the relays are faster than the spark over Manny contacts and then i can get that full spark in to the cap. actually the hard part is the the "short" contact. because the voltage is so high when trying to short that it will spark before it makes. more relays are needed i guess to do the trick.


also, for some notes here on a slightly different subject:

The SFR is indeed close to 90 degrees out of phase. ( current and voltage) as expected.
This brings up some interesting points.

if the current is "slamming to one side" then what happens to the voltage. theses 2 components are much diffrent when a cap is added. they ac differently.

you see, with no added caps, There is no real effect on the rotor, ( no/all most no lenz effect at all from my testing) but with a cap, there is added lenz effect. That current is now slowed heading to the end of the wire with caps added.

so adding caps slows down the resonant frequency, but SRF and resonance with caps is totally different in the way the system reacts to that change.


Just some notes for everyone to think about and also to think about what i was saying here:

http://open-source-energy.org/?topic=3128.msg48431#msg48431

Extracting current with out CEMF OR INDUCTION. ( also ohms law not applied to the 45K ohms from my testing. but more proof is needed. but see my post in the link above to see why i say that's it even possible)

using the magnet to "push" this one way or another is a real effect that is normally not used with such motor / generator systems that I'm aware of.

I got a lot of the stagnant testing done but i will be doing more. then some dynamic testing will began.

~Russ

something i found very very relevant:

http://www.tuks.nl/wiki/index.php/Main/FEETNotes

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It struck me that the "spark gap protection device 42" is not a protection device at all. It looks like it's actually the main spark gap that forms a classic spark gap discharge circuit, very similar to what Tesla was using for driving the primary of his Tesla coil. It's discharge path goes from HV cap 16 trough spark gap 42 (which has been drawn a bit strangely, to say the least), induction coil 36, cap 38 and battery 18.

With that in mind, we can find Gray's actual secret, the production of extreme pulses of magnetic force using a negative resistance device, in Eric Dollard's [http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Eric_Dollard_Document_Collection/Condensed_Intro_Tesla_Coils(OCR).pdf "Condensed Intro to Tesla Coils"]:
The formation of the energy impulse involves the discharge of a capacitor with the highest practical stored energy into an impedance (inductive) of the lowest practical value, and the discharge path is coupled to an energy supply through a negative resistance device. This negative resistance is classically a spark discharge, but a superior plasma device needs to be developed to enhance efficiency. Under optimal conditions the exponent of oscillation amplitude will be positive over a sustained period of time.
The net result of this system is the production of an extreme impulse of M.M.F. (magnetic force).

What makes a negative resistance device so interesting for steering coils into resonance for applications in magnetic motors is that the current trough a practical negative resistance device, like a spark gap or lambda diode, is always positive! See for example the I-V curve of a typical [http://lcbsystems.com/LambdaDiode.html lambda diode] circuit:

That means you can get a coil into a resonance mode where you have a superposition of a DC current and a complex AC wave going trough it, such that the magnetic field is directed into one direction. In other words: there are no areas in the coil where a reverse direction of the magentic field occurs. So, this DC offset is very important for the application of resonating coils in attracting/repelling motors. What happens is that besides the normal DC current going trough the coil, generating a magnetic field, you get additional wave-like impulses going trough the coil, which travel at a much greater speed than electrons (DC current), and therefore generate an extremely powerful magnetic field inside the coil, which you can harness using magnetic attraction/repelling in a motor as well as by capturing the BEMF when allowing the magnetic field to collapse.

This is what i have been trying to express. and now even more clearly expressed there. not that i agree with 100% of it it guides us in to what i was saying.

and when working with such a massive coil..... well its extremely obvious that this DC off set ( that " pushing' i was talking about. via the magnet)   and the negative resistance i was talking about in the past SFA videos ...

others here also expressed that the spark gap was very important and substantiating that arc in the right mode is also very important.

 Just more for us to agree on. as i stated i could put more current in the coil that the resistance and induction is i could under normal circumstances. There for also extract more.

 
~Russ

Too bad you can't get your hands on a vacuum transistor created by NASA.  Article

I've been wondering about florescent light starters.  I have a few to play with here, but that is on down the road of my experiments.  Maybe set one over a candle to heat it up and see if it will pass voltage easier...could you put two together and apply a voltage between the two to act like a transistor.  I don't know...you guys probably do, but It is on my things to do list.  Currently I am blowing up opto-couplers because I know so little about electronics...current limiting resistors...who knew. lol