Look at the drawing of genee.

The current is canceled (nearly 0amps) in the VIC. Thats the basic achievment first IMHO.

This also can be performed with inductivities which differ to the original VIC.
You can tune the inductivity with the air gap of the VIC with it´s 2x"U" - profile core.
Do not fix on the frequencys, they are second-rate. The first priority is to cancel the ampflow on the secondary side of the vic to reach higher voltages.

Quote from Amsy on July 6th, 2012, 11:25 PM

Look at the drawing of genee.

The current is canceled (nearly 0amps) in the VIC. Thats the basic achievment first IMHO.

This also can be performed with inductivities which differ to the original VIC.
You can tune the inductivity with the air gap of the VIC with it´s 2x"U" - profile core.
Do not fix on the frequencys, they are second-rate. The first priority is to cancel the ampflow on the secondary side of the vic to reach higher voltages.

Common man ,what amp flow to you talk about? on a transformer of 30awg,you dont get amps,plain and simple,the wire is to thin,if you hook up a 24v headlight bulb on a 2kv flyback nothing happens,why? because it has no power to light it,put whatever voltage you want on the cell,it will cancel it out,like i explained earlier,barely few bubles ore formed on a neg side of the probe/wire if you ''electrify a water droplet..try it for yourself

Quote from adys15 on July 6th, 2012, 03:19 PM

from 5kv- 5v i think...whatever tiret of that Meyer shet,sound very nice on paper but in real world nothing happens!!!

that´s not true. we got nearly 1000v in the wfc. you have to fine tune the windings and make an exact frequency scan to get those results. and you have to integrate the EEC and you will see the difference.

Quote from adys15 on July 7th, 2012, 01:40 AM

Quote from Amsy on July 6th, 2012, 11:25 PM

Look at the drawing of genee.

The current is canceled (nearly 0amps) in the VIC. Thats the basic achievment first IMHO.

This also can be performed with inductivities which differ to the original VIC.
You can tune the inductivity with the air gap of the VIC with it´s 2x"U" - profile core.
Do not fix on the frequencys, they are second-rate. The first priority is to cancel the ampflow on the secondary side of the vic to reach higher voltages.

Common man ,what amp flow to you talk about? on a transformer of 30awg,you dont get amps,plain and simple,the wire is to thin,if you hook up a 24v headlight bulb on a 2kv flyback nothing happens,why? because it has no power to light it,put whatever voltage you want on the cell,it will cancel it out,like i explained earlier,barely few bubles ore formed on a neg side of the probe/wire if you ''electrify a water droplet..try it for yourself

maybe,many Meyer's vic coils on his car,that connected together in parallel cause very thin and no power.
i have questions.
why resonant cavity connect tube wire in series(but more vic coils-U core and plastic solid core)?how many tube is heater resonant?
 

thanks
geenee

all,

please read this:
http://open-source-energy.org/rwg42985/russ/Patents/Andrija%20Puharich-US4394230.pdf

dont skip around, read it in its entirety.

this is the only place i have found where some one explains the process stan understood so well.

staged A-F

if these things dont hapen in that order and in that way... we will never get it to work.

its not a coil and water cap and some pulses. ECT.

its a very very precise and orderly process that MUST happen in that order of it will not work.

***Note, that is a patent... so he is not giving you the exact  info you need to get it to work, he is giving you what you need to know to understand how to make it work... ***

basically what I'm telling you is that know one can say that something can not be done. just because you can not get it to work... that just mean's you dont understand it enough to make it work.

healthy discussion is welcome here and is encouraged as that's the way life is. things get done that way. BUT. if your here to tell others that it just dont work and its all fake... please leave or do not comment.

the work i have done dose not push me away and make me think its fake. it draws me closer and makes me try more to  understand whats really going on in stan's system.

the point of this post is to make everyone think about why there here.

this place was started to gather the same like to achieve a goal. if one dose not think the goal will be reached and can not be understanding about it please do not diss-courage others here. we are a support group for each other. again, a healthy discussion is welcome.


thanks guys for your understanding and for anyone that is going to take this message the wrong way.... sorry. got to keep this place rocking... moving forward...

we all share, we all teach, we all learn, we all win, knowledge is power. dont need money or other. a good understanding it always key.

Blessings and GOD Bless

~Russ

PS. dont hate me... lol

:) lol Russ,i agree.

Don't give up.Crack the secret of Meyer.water car is real.

all reference patents from Meyer patents.that is the key.

PS.dont hate RUSS... lol

thanks
geenee

Quote from geenee on July 8th, 2012, 08:39 AM

:) lol Russ,i agree.

Don't give up.Crack the secret of Meyer.water car is real.

all reference patents from Meyer patents.that is the key.

PS.dont hate RUSS... lol

thanks
geenee

You can find all refrance patents on my web site here:

All patents and info:

http://rwgresearch.com/open-projects/stanley-meyers-wfc-tec/patents-documents/

Direct link to just the refrance patents in Stan's patents:

http://open-source-energy.org/rwg42985/russ/Patents/Stan_Meyer_Reference_Patents.zip

Thanks!!!! Much Respect to you all guys! ;)

~Russ

Quote from adys15 on July 7th, 2012, 01:40 AM

Quote from Amsy on July 6th, 2012, 11:25 PM

Look at the drawing of genee.

The current is canceled (nearly 0amps) in the VIC. Thats the basic achievment first IMHO.

This also can be performed with inductivities which differ to the original VIC.
You can tune the inductivity with the air gap of the VIC with it´s 2x"U" - profile core.
Do not fix on the frequencys, they are second-rate. The first priority is to cancel the ampflow on the secondary side of the vic to reach higher voltages.

Common man ,what amp flow to you talk about? on a transformer of 30awg,you dont get amps,plain and simple,the wire is to thin,if you hook up a 24v headlight bulb on a 2kv flyback nothing happens,why? because it has no power to light it,put whatever voltage you want on the cell,it will cancel it out,like i explained earlier,barely few bubles ore formed on a neg side of the probe/wire if you ''electrify a water droplet..try it for yourself

Sorry, was a misunderstanding. My post was for HMS-776.

See your post now, I think 2kV will not be enough. Meyer patents say something about 20kV :exclamation:  Lets try higher voltages.

Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on July 8th, 2012, 09:20 AM

Quote from geenee on July 8th, 2012, 08:39 AM

:) lol Russ,i agree.

Don't give up.Crack the secret of Meyer.water car is real.

all reference patents from Meyer patents.that is the key.

PS.dont hate RUSS... lol

thanks
geenee

You can find all refrance patents on my web site here:

All patents and info:

http://rwgresearch.com/open-projects/stanley-meyers-wfc-tec/patents-documents/

Direct link to just the refrance patents in Stan's patents:

http://open-source-energy.org/rwg42985/russ/Patents/Stan_Meyer_Reference_Patents.zip

Thanks!!!! Much Respect to you all guys! ;)

~Russ

problems are not really impossible, they are just very difficult to solve

Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on July 8th, 2012, 07:18 AM

basically what I'm telling you is that know one can say that something can not be done. just because you can not get it to work... that just mean's you dont understand it enough to make it work.

healthy discussion is welcome here and is encouraged as that's the way life is. things get done that way. BUT. if your here to tell others that it just dont work and its all fake... please leave or do not comment.

Currently, nobody has a "true working replication" of Stan's work, specifically the VIC circuit, as far as I know.

I'm sure Russ has made it clear that this forum is not about jumping to conclusions until a "true working replication" has been achieved and documented.

Stan took 15 years to develop his technology. so we have to invest some time to get it replicated. I started at Energetic forum , found hereticalbuilders as my pole position and now I take part at open-source.

My observations show that people make some progress up to a certain  point and then they get stucked.

it always happens when entering experimental state. so there is a long startup phase (people building some circuits and devices) and then if (of course) it doesn´t work like a charme it stucks.

reasons as far as I can see:

- no coordinated experimentation and exchange of results
- no workload sharing
- no precise equippment

examples:

where is a thread for straight forward experimental results compilation?
where is a lessons learned for advanced experimental equippment?

I built those types of pulsers like Russ and others 2 years ago and I know very well their weak points from the beginning of this forum acitvity. I posted that but got no positive response. so things have to go the long way - no short cut - ok.

to sum up my observations lots of efforts are done by people in the startup phase   as long as there is quick progress visible.
at phase 2 - the more important phase when things get tricky people get frustrated at the very beginning and get stuck into discussions instead of continuous experimentation.

Quote from bussi04 on July 10th, 2012, 11:30 PM

Stan took 15 years to develop his technology. so we have to invest some time to get it replicated. I started at Energetic forum , found hereticalbuilders as my pole position and now I take part at open-source.

My observations show that people make some progress up to a certain  point and then they get stucked.

it always happens when entering experimental state. so there is a long startup phase (people building some circuits and devices) and then if (of course) it doesn´t work like a charme it stucks.

reasons as far as I can see:

- no coordinated experimentation and exchange of results
- no workload sharing
- no precise equippment

examples:

where is a thread for straight forward experimental results compilation?
where is a lessons learned for advanced experimental equippment?

I built those types of pulsers like Russ and others 2 years ago and I know very well their weak points from the beginning of this forum acitvity. I posted that but got no positive response. so things have to go the long way - no short cut - ok.

to sum up my observations lots of efforts are done by people in the startup phase   as long as there is quick progress visible.
at phase 2 - the more important phase when things get tricky people get frustrated at the very beginning and get stuck into discussions instead of continuous experimentation.

Bussi you are right on the spot with your comments!

Up to now nobody has been able to replicate the 'visible' results of stanley meyer. With all the available information like patents and photos we have been able to replicate the WFC technology upto a certain point but if it was as easy as winding some coils, connect it to a cell and sent a pulsed DC signal into it to make it work a lot of us would already have achieved that a long time ago. So the conclusion about replication is: we can replicate the system with all the currently available information but that will only supply some important preconditions and will not result in excessive hho production

What is needed then? Simply put: RESEARCH !!! and no, ... research is not replication! Research is all about understanding and iterating through: building, testing, measuring, interpretation of results and back to building again. Every iteration will bring you closer to the solution. If you do not make and document your measurements and if you do not try to understand and scientifically explain your testresults before you continue to the next iteration your next iteration will be useless and you will get 'stuck' as Bussi states.

So research requires something more than replication and not all are able to do that. If you are into research keep positive and add to the discussions over here, if you are into replication subscribe to Russ'es emaillist and you get notified as soon as we got the job done (either proving or disproving the Meyer WFC tech).

For all the rest and the naysayers please refer to:
http://www.open-source-energy.org/?tid=498

I agree with you both Bussi and Sharky, like I have said many times before, we need to prove or disprove every idea and document what we are doing. :idea: I really think we need much more controlled organization, no disrespect to Russ or anyone else for that matter, but Russ has said he can't do it all, as Bussi said, it took Stan 15 years to develop his technology, well, we don't have 15 years :huh: , we might have a year at most before someone comes in and shuts us down or something else happens :angel: . Any good leader will delegate tasks to be accomplished, Russ has done this to a degree, but what is really needed and no disrespect again, is for members of this forum to step up. I suggest we form five or six teams of people willing to take the lead, of research in the different aspects of Stan's technology, to focus on this only, all having a team leaders, who would document what is being learned. I realize we all have responsibilities, making a living and families, this would take priority over the research, too, this is volunteer work. Things on the forum have slowed down to a snails pace, what I am wishing for are members willing to take up the slack to speed things up, time is running out without your help this work will not get done.

Hi all,

Are there other members who measured the capacitance of the 3 inch WFC with different types of water in it?

I have tried and measured the WFC air capacitance with a automatic capacitance metering device. And measured 39.4pF @ 200kHz. Dynodon had 21.6pF.

With tap water I measure the capacitance, 260uF DC. :huh:
(I think my automatic meter is useless for this task and I can't set it to manual mode)

I build and tested the VIC v1.1 pcb.
Are there members who are also testing this circuit with default components?

Any progress here or somewhere...connecting the v1.1, 3 inch WFC and VIC (1200perm core) ???

I think it's time to synchronize all data in a dedicated v1.1 only thread, if we don't combine data and sync one design for testing results, it remains very difficult to replicate the final VIC setup with different setups.

Br,
Webmug

Sorry for the offtopic but  anyone knows this song? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76QMrkO1K44  the original one not this''cover''
Is also on peswiky radio interviews

Things have definately slowed over the last month or so, but that is just part of the research phase. At times there's just not alot going on and other times your waiting for parts/supplies.

Here the heat has kept me out of the garage. In the garage today it's around 105.

Hopefully things will get working soon. Until then take care everyone,


HMS-776

Well,

Still working on finding resonance.

When using a function generator in conjunction with a spectrum analyzer some interesting things happen. The spectrum analyzer shows that as the applied frequency changes the peaks also change. To me this suggests the capacitance changes drastically with frequency. That is one reason why it's so hard to find resonance on this circuit.

Another interesting thing is that the circuit acts as a filter. At times the square waves turn into sine waves, or amplitude modulation. And at some frequencies the square wave is multiple times lower in frequency than the applied square wave. For instance at 20.5kHz applied the wave across the cap is 40Hz.

Not sure exactly what's going on here. But the capacitor is definately non-linear (even using distilled water).

Quote from HMS-776 on July 20th, 2012, 09:57 PM

Well,

Still working on finding resonance.

When using a function generator in conjunction with a spectrum analyzer some interesting things happen. The spectrum analyzer shows that as the applied frequency changes the peaks also change. To me this suggests the capacitance changes drastically with frequency. That is one reason why it's so hard to find resonance on this circuit.

Another interesting thing is that the circuit acts as a filter. At times the square waves turn into sine waves, or amplitude modulation. And at some frequencies the square wave is multiple times lower in frequency than the applied square wave. For instance at 20.5kHz applied the wave across the cap is 40Hz.

Not sure exactly what's going on here. But the capacitor is definately non-linear (even using distilled water).

Hi HMS,

Affirmative: capacitance / inductance changes on different frequencies... so I picked one for tuning the coils and wfc on. (example f0=4.5kHz -> fr=9kHz you have WFC C and inductance L and want impedance WFC <= COILS)

Frequency fr is doubled so charge frequency f0 is halve fr. (blocking diode)

Br,
Webmug

Quote from Jeff Nading on July 11th, 2012, 07:35 AM

I agree with you both Bussi and Sharky, like I have said many times before, we need to prove or disprove every idea and document what we are doing. :idea: I really think we need much more controlled organization, no disrespect to Russ or anyone else for that matter, but Russ has said he can't do it all, as Bussi said, it took Stan 15 years to develop his technology, well, we don't have 15 years :huh: , we might have a year at most before someone comes in and shuts us down or something else happens :angel: . Any good leader will delegate tasks to be accomplished, Russ has done this to a degree, but what is really needed and no disrespect again, is for members of this forum to step up. I suggest we form five or six teams of people willing to take the lead, of research in the different aspects of Stan's technology, to focus on this only, all having a team leaders, who would document what is being learned. I realize we all have responsibilities, making a living and families, this would take priority over the research, too, this is volunteer work. Things on the forum have slowed down to a snails pace, what I am wishing for are members willing to take up the slack to speed things up, time is running out without your help this work will not get done.

I like this idea of having teams and team leaders.  I've been watching this forum for a little while, and waiting for an opportunity to help out, just haven't found out how that is yet.  What I'm seeing are guys like Jeff, bussi, HMS-776, Sharky, twoodside, alexpetty, Russ, who have years of experience and tons of useful information, but a lot of times it's completely ignored!  Or, their useful comments are buried in a thread because right after they post, all of the sudden a dozen posts are dumped in the thread with very little value.  Better collaboration is needed! Maybe project specific wiki's, teams for each project w/ team leaders.  Leaders give their team members very specific tasks and goals... document progress and results in threads, but keep wiki's updated as the "how-to" for newbies to get up to speed as quickly as possible.  One team could just handle material supply, that seems to be an ongoing issue.  Periodic posts of "who's interested in a complete VIC, we're putting in a large order".  Develop kits containing the wire, cores, coils, circuit boards, etc.  I know some of this is being done, but not as organized as it could be.
I don't have any electronics background, so I've been digging for information for months, and I'm still lost.  It's overwhelming, so I'm focusing on a very small piece of the puzzle, the water injector, and working on a homemade gas generator just to get some hands on experience in  fabricating and electronics.

Quote from Badger on July 24th, 2012, 06:33 AM

Quote from Jeff Nading on July 11th, 2012, 07:35 AM

I agree with you both Bussi and Sharky, like I have said many times before, we need to prove or disprove every idea and document what we are doing. :idea: I really think we need much more controlled organization, no disrespect to Russ or anyone else for that matter, but Russ has said he can't do it all, as Bussi said, it took Stan 15 years to develop his technology, well, we don't have 15 years :huh: , we might have a year at most before someone comes in and shuts us down or something else happens :angel: . Any good leader will delegate tasks to be accomplished, Russ has done this to a degree, but what is really needed and no disrespect again, is for members of this forum to step up. I suggest we form five or six teams of people willing to take the lead, of research in the different aspects of Stan's technology, to focus on this only, all having a team leaders, who would document what is being learned. I realize we all have responsibilities, making a living and families, this would take priority over the research, too, this is volunteer work. Things on the forum have slowed down to a snails pace, what I am wishing for are members willing to take up the slack to speed things up, time is running out without your help this work will not get done.

I like this idea of having teams and team leaders.  I've been watching this forum for a little while, and waiting for an opportunity to help out, just haven't found out how that is yet.  What I'm seeing are guys like Jeff, bussi, HMS-776, Sharky, twoodside, alexpetty, Russ, who have years of experience and tons of useful information, but a lot of times it's completely ignored!  Or, their useful comments are buried in a thread because right after they post, all of the sudden a dozen posts are dumped in the thread with very little value.  Better collaboration is needed! Maybe project specific wiki's, teams for each project w/ team leaders.  Leaders give their team members very specific tasks and goals... document progress and results in threads, but keep wiki's updated as the "how-to" for newbies to get up to speed as quickly as possible.  One team could just handle material supply, that seems to be an ongoing issue.  Periodic posts of "who's interested in a complete VIC, we're putting in a large order".  Develop kits containing the wire, cores, coils, circuit boards, etc.  I know some of this is being done, but not as organized as it could be.
I don't have any electronics background, so I've been digging for information for months, and I'm still lost.  It's overwhelming, so I'm focusing on a very small piece of the puzzle, the water injector, and working on a homemade gas generator just to get some hands on experience in  fabricating and electronics.

Those are very excellent ideas :idea:  Badger and should be implemented, :cool:  we need Russ to see this, I will move these thoughts to the round table discussion part of the forum, so please anyone wanting to add their thoughts to this please do so there, I should have posted this there as well, thanks Jeff.:D

WikiSpeed is using an organizing system used by software engineers do build their open source cars.  They have people working all over the world on certain areas of the car.   Might be worth looking into how their system works, and try to apply it to our research.

Nate

Suggest making

Scrum board on components

http://www.scrumy.com/

to power through more

check web for wikispeed team as example

A MUST WATCH

WE CAN DO IT

https://www.youtube.com/user/WIKISPEED

 

You just don't give up do you, Valyonpz1?
This is how many times you've posted this?
10?
How about posting a clip showing how your WFC is performing in terms of
gas output, water temperature, electric effect input, etc etc.
Or doesn't it work the way it's supposed to be working?

Valyonpz1 stop posting this video. Please. It does not help the discussion in any way and you just make yourself look truculent.

Put some details with regard to open source and how to replicate, offer some insight into who is doing what and how, or just plain stop it.

Please.

Hi @All,
I'm waking up this thread, since it's in a kind of hibernation mode :D

RULE: Stan Meyer (EPP) Electrical Polarization Process
http://open-source-energy.org/?tid=188&pid=5948#pid5948

2-6:Principles of Electrodynamics
Principles of Electrodynamics (polarization)

Vibrational Contributions to Molecular Dipole Polarizabilities
 "When a molecule is placed in an electric field it exhibits molecular polarization, a property which, in principle, has three components: orientation polarization, electronic polarization and vibrational polarization. (book concerned with the last component)"
http://www.nist.gov/data/PDFfiles/jpcrd199.pdf

Chapter I:Atoms, Molecules And Clusters in Electric Fields
Atoms, Molecules And Clusters in Electric Fields

"This article is limited to static phenomena, and does not describe time-dependent or dynamic polarization."
Electric dipole moment

Did someone noticed the total capacitance C1 (L1 Cp and Cwfc) has different capacitance C2 (L2 Cp and Cwfc). Choke L1 connected to POS exciter and choke L2 to NEG exciter?
Because there is a ROD and TUBE, two exciters of different dimensions.
"The tunable L2 coil"

This current restricting only works if C's are equal compensated and the two L's are the same. So there is the same resonance frequency for both chokes (highest static pulsating potential at lowest current). According to Meyer voltage then takes over.

Best regards,
Webmug