Quote from adys15 on October 4th, 2012, 10:24 AM

Hello webmug!what skematic do you use for gating circuit?I have Stans original skematic but does not work.I recieve the signal from 4001 but does not triger the 74122!!!when  conect directly the square wave rom the 9xa to the 3/4 pins on 74122 it outputs some sort of adjustable wave,so the cip works.but not with the input from 4001... i have also a 74123 but don't know how to hook it up.I have trying to get the circuit working for over 5 monts...I am so frustrated...so please anyone can help? :(

Adys,

I use an Arduino for pulse and gating--works nicely.  See my post at:
http://open-source-energy.org/?tid=599&pid=7814#pid7814

Hopefully this will help you get over the hump.

Quote from Dog-One on October 4th, 2012, 10:34 AM

Quote from adys15 on October 4th, 2012, 10:24 AM

Hello webmug!what skematic do you use for gating circuit?I have Stans original skematic but does not work.I recieve the signal from 4001 but does not triger the 74122!!!when  conect directly the square wave rom the 9xa to the 3/4 pins on 74122 it outputs some sort of adjustable wave,so the cip works.but not with the input from 4001... i have also a 74123 but don't know how to hook it up.I have trying to get the circuit working for over 5 monts...I am so frustrated...so please anyone can help? :(

Adys,

I use an Arduino for pulse and gating--works nicely.  See my post at:
http://open-source-energy.org/?tid=599&pid=7814#pid7814

Hopefully this will help you get over the hump.

thanks dog-one!I have to buy the andruino board to program it?

Quote from adys15 on October 4th, 2012, 10:46 AM

thanks dog-one!

I have to buy the andruino board to program it?

You are very welcome.  It's been quite helpful for me.  I have a signal generator with gating, but wanted something more portable.  The Arduino board is pretty powerful and flexible--much more so than a couple of 555 timers strung together with some gates.

I purchased mine at SparkFun and attached to my referenced post is the software I wrote to do pulses with gating.  The program I wrote has some "factory defaults" that are tuned to my step-up torroid circuit so I can just plug it in and be functional straight away.  The software allows you to connect it to a computer and using a terminal emulator like PuTTY to change the settings of the two timer circuits--pulse on/off time, duty cycle and frequency.  Makes it very easy to walk through a tuning cycle.  I use a divide and conquer technique--start low, then high and walk my way towards some intermediate value of frequency and duty cycle for each timer.

Nothing wrong using discrete circuits and if I was to find an exact set of timings, I would consider doing this too.  In the stage of the game that I'm at now, I need something more versatile and found using a little micro controller like the Arduino to be very effective.

If you decide to go this way and run into any troubles, just shoot me a private message and I'll be happy to help.

Quote from Dog-One on October 4th, 2012, 05:16 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 4th, 2012, 10:46 AM

thanks dog-one!

I have to buy the andruino board to program it?

You are very welcome.  It's been quite helpful for me.  I have a signal generator with gating, but wanted something more portable.  The Arduino board is pretty powerful and flexible--much more so than a couple of 555 timers strung together with some gates.

I purchased mine at SparkFun and attached to my referenced post is the software I wrote to do pulses with gating.  The program I wrote has some "factory defaults" that are tuned to my step-up torroid circuit so I can just plug it in and be functional straight away.  The software allows you to connect it to a computer and using a terminal emulator like PuTTY to change the settings of the two timer circuits--pulse on/off time, duty cycle and frequency.  Makes it very easy to walk through a tuning cycle.  I use a divide and conquer technique--start low, then high and walk my way towards some intermediate value of frequency and duty cycle for each timer.

Nothing wrong using discrete circuits and if I was to find an exact set of timings, I would consider doing this too.  In the stage of the game that I'm at now, I need something more versatile and found using a little micro controller like the Arduino to be very effective.

If you decide to go this way and run into any troubles, just shoot me a private message and I'll be happy to help.

Hi dog one, are you using the mega or the uno arduino, also can you show pins out? Do you have a video of your setup? Thanks Jeff.:D

Quote from Webmug on October 4th, 2012, 08:17 AM

I have a problem with this Bifilar Coils construction story telling.
According to the photos from Dynodon the chokes are not wound Bifilar on one bobbin. So they do not cancel out the self-inductances.

Also when we pulse the primary on let's say 5kHz we see AC on resonance and no PULSE square wave at from the secondary coil.

Regards!

Hy Webmug,

you are right, it is not the same as a tesla constructed coil. But, for canceling the self-inductance it enough when the coils are on the same core, because the core can store the energy in a magnetic field and also the second coil will react on the changing magnetic field. Every transformer operations works like this. You also can look at a real flyback transformator, which is using the back emf.

But unfortunatellty we all know, whats happens if we let the self inductances/back emf hit the WFC. ->Nothing will happen, because, the voltage can not rise. If the resistance in the WFC would in a range of Mohm it would work.

Regards

Quote from geenee on October 3rd, 2012, 06:50 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 3rd, 2012, 03:30 PM

I saw kevin's youtube chanel and it says it uses koh,so no replication here

i think "little koh+distilled water = tap water but... why?, tap water has many contaminations".he's nearly done his project.this is Meyer's alternator version(rewired alternator).alternator version use both electrolysis and high voltage spike.

he show wave form,look like Meyer's wave form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvIENzciM&feature=channel&list=UL



thanks
geenee

all we need is disruptive discharge or abruptly discharge or shock wave,tesla tech.like Russ tested(Papp engine).dc capacitor discharge like that but more more voltage. Russ charge his capacitor to about 250v but tesla charge capacitor to 10000v+ that more power than that and has string effect to physical , to body Independent from distance. disruptive discharge can product shock wave=high electrostatic force few millisecond.Like JP said if Meyer rise 10000+V and 50khz he can split 1 litre of water a second.

quote i posted,that is success inventor,from Meyer's alternator version.--->www.waterforfuel.com

how alternator work,side effect of alternate current is shock wave or disruptive discharge or voltage spike or electrostatic charge.and he use electrolysis too + electrostatic charge for shock wave.

problem is how????- -*

PS.Secrets of Cold War Technology is good book about Tesla's tech.that can explained about disruptive discharge very well.

thanks
geenee

Quote from Dog-One on October 4th, 2012, 05:16 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 4th, 2012, 10:46 AM

thanks dog-one!

I have to buy the andruino board to program it?

You are very welcome.  It's been quite helpful for me.  I have a signal generator with gating, but wanted something more portable.  The Arduino board is pretty powerful and flexible--much more so than a couple of 555 timers strung together with some gates.

I purchased mine at SparkFun and attached to my referenced post is the software I wrote to do pulses with gating.  The program I wrote has some "factory defaults" that are tuned to my step-up torroid circuit so I can just plug it in and be functional straight away.  The software allows you to connect it to a computer and using a terminal emulator like PuTTY to change the settings of the two timer circuits--pulse on/off time, duty cycle and frequency.  Makes it very easy to walk through a tuning cycle.  I use a divide and conquer technique--start low, then high and walk my way towards some intermediate value of frequency and duty cycle for each timer.

Nothing wrong using discrete circuits and if I was to find an exact set of timings, I would consider doing this too.  In the stage of the game that I'm at now, I need something more versatile and found using a little micro controller like the Arduino to be very effective.

If you decide to go this way and run into any troubles, just shoot me a private message and I'll be happy to help.

Thanks again Dog-one.but for the moment i can afford to buy the andr.board,the cips are lot cheap and can do the boards myself,i like the hands one aproach more,the traces are 100%corect i think the 74122 is foulty thats why i try to adapt the'123.i cannot buy another 74122 because the one i have i have to purchease all the way from England and i am from Romania,so verry hard.....because of this cip i cannot test nothing...Cheers!

Quote from Jeff Nading on October 4th, 2012, 08:39 PM

Hi dog one, are you using the mega or the uno arduino, also can you show pins out? Do you have a video of your setup? Thanks Jeff.:D

It is the Uno model.  The pins are selectable via software and the default is:
Pin A (5) slow timer (gating)
Pin B (6) fast timer (pulse)
Pin C (13) multiplexed signal (output) -- should also have a small LED on-board to verify with.

No videos yet--maybe I'll get my son to pan around with his iTouch and upload something.  Probably do it in my "V.I.C. Rehash" thread should I make considerable progress.  I might even start a new thread with the whole sha-bang detailed if I happen to figure out how to hit resonance and make HHO with practically no current draw.

Quote from geenee on October 5th, 2012, 01:05 AM

Quote from geenee on October 3rd, 2012, 06:50 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 3rd, 2012, 03:30 PM

I saw kevin's youtube chanel and it says it uses koh,so no replication here

i think "little koh+distilled water = tap water but... why?, tap water has many contaminations".he's nearly done his project.this is Meyer's alternator version(rewired alternator).alternator version use both electrolysis and high voltage spike.

he show wave form,look like Meyer's wave form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvIENzciM&feature=channel&list=UL



thanks
geenee

all we need is disruptive discharge or abruptly discharge or shock wave,tesla tech.like Russ tested(Papp engine).dc capacitor discharge like that but more more voltage. Russ charge his capacitor to about 250v but tesla charge capacitor to 10000v+ that more power than that and has string effect to physical , to body Independent from distance. disruptive discharge can product shock wave=high electrostatic force few millisecond.Like JP said if Meyer rise 10000+V and 50khz he can split 1 litre of water a second.

quote i posted,that is success inventor,from Meyer's alternator version.--->www.waterforfuel.com

how alternator work,side effect of alternate current is shock wave or disruptive discharge or voltage spike or electrostatic charge.and he use electrolysis too + electrostatic charge for shock wave.

problem is how????- -*

PS.Secrets of Cold War Technology is good book about Tesla's tech.that can explained about disruptive discharge very well.

thanks
geenee

What I quoted Stan as saying was "10,000 Volts at 50kHz will convert a GALLON of water a second."
That was in his demonstration cell with the 9 tubes of 304 stainless steel.
Getting the alternator figured out as part of the voltage intensification and amp restriction is a key to running the car.

Cheers,
JP

Nice video about inductors, resistance, resonance, and energy propagation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

Here is one of Woodside's on LC circuit, VIC, and wave forms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-x3PVi8wF0&feature=related

And from irondmax wave forms on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC3X98TJuBY&feature=endscreen&NR=1

Hope this helps out there.
JP

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 5th, 2012, 11:57 AM

Quote from geenee on October 5th, 2012, 01:05 AM

Quote from geenee on October 3rd, 2012, 06:50 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 3rd, 2012, 03:30 PM

I saw kevin's youtube chanel and it says it uses koh,so no replication here

i think "little koh+distilled water = tap water but... why?, tap water has many contaminations".he's nearly done his project.this is Meyer's alternator version(rewired alternator).alternator version use both electrolysis and high voltage spike.

he show wave form,look like Meyer's wave form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvIENzciM&feature=channel&list=UL



thanks
geenee

all we need is disruptive discharge or abruptly discharge or shock wave,tesla tech.like Russ tested(Papp engine).dc capacitor discharge like that but more more voltage. Russ charge his capacitor to about 250v but tesla charge capacitor to 10000v+ that more power than that and has string effect to physical , to body Independent from distance. disruptive discharge can product shock wave=high electrostatic force few millisecond.Like JP said if Meyer rise 10000+V and 50khz he can split 1 litre of water a second.

quote i posted,that is success inventor,from Meyer's alternator version.--->www.waterforfuel.com

how alternator work,side effect of alternate current is shock wave or disruptive discharge or voltage spike or electrostatic charge.and he use electrolysis too + electrostatic charge for shock wave.

problem is how????- -*

PS.Secrets of Cold War Technology is good book about Tesla's tech.that can explained about disruptive discharge very well.

thanks
geenee

What I quoted Stan as saying was "10,000 Volts at 50kHz will convert a GALLON of water a second."
That was in his demonstration cell with the 9 tubes of 304 stainless steel.
Getting the alternator figured out as part of the voltage intensification and amp restriction is a key to running the car.

Cheers,
JP

wrong remember!!!- -*

JP,i have a question.
-What bifilar coil type does Meyer use?inductive canceling or inductive coupling?

this circuit is overunity???(attached picture)

thanks
geenee

Quote from geenee on October 6th, 2012, 09:17 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 5th, 2012, 11:57 AM

Quote from geenee on October 5th, 2012, 01:05 AM

Quote from geenee on October 3rd, 2012, 06:50 PM

Quote from adys15 on October 3rd, 2012, 03:30 PM

I saw kevin's youtube chanel and it says it uses koh,so no replication here

i think "little koh+distilled water = tap water but... why?, tap water has many contaminations".he's nearly done his project.this is Meyer's alternator version(rewired alternator).alternator version use both electrolysis and high voltage spike.

he show wave form,look like Meyer's wave form.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdEvIENzciM&feature=channel&list=UL



thanks
geenee

all we need is disruptive discharge or abruptly discharge or shock wave,tesla tech.like Russ tested(Papp engine).dc capacitor discharge like that but more more voltage. Russ charge his capacitor to about 250v but tesla charge capacitor to 10000v+ that more power than that and has string effect to physical , to body Independent from distance. disruptive discharge can product shock wave=high electrostatic force few millisecond.Like JP said if Meyer rise 10000+V and 50khz he can split 1 litre of water a second.

quote i posted,that is success inventor,from Meyer's alternator version.--->www.waterforfuel.com

how alternator work,side effect of alternate current is shock wave or disruptive discharge or voltage spike or electrostatic charge.and he use electrolysis too + electrostatic charge for shock wave.

problem is how????- -*

PS.Secrets of Cold War Technology is good book about Tesla's tech.that can explained about disruptive discharge very well.

thanks
geenee

What I quoted Stan as saying was "10,000 Volts at 50kHz will convert a GALLON of water a second."
That was in his demonstration cell with the 9 tubes of 304 stainless steel.
Getting the alternator figured out as part of the voltage intensification and amp restriction is a key to running the car.

Cheers,
JP

wrong remember!!!- -*

JP,i have a question.
-What bifilar coil type does Meyer use?inductive canceling or inductive coupling?

this circuit is overunity???(attached picture)

thanks
geenee

I can't begin to answer that as I said I am not an EE other type of technician.
I have a basis in how Meyer described it and how it works but cannot put that into knowledge of hardware.
I try to learn something myself by searching.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inductive_coupling
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_inductive_coupling

Looks like we have a winner..."tesla coil"

Resonant inductive coupling or electrodynamic induction is the near field wireless transmission of electrical energy between two coils that are tuned to resonate at the same frequency. The equipment to do this is sometimes called a resonant or resonance transformer. While many transformers employ resonance, this type has a high Q and is often air cored to avoid 'iron' losses. The two coils may exist as a single piece of equipment or comprise two separate pieces of equipment.

Resonant transfer works by making a coil ring with an oscillating current. This generates an oscillating magnetic field. Because the coil is highly resonant any energy placed in the coil dies away relatively slowly over very many cycles; but if a second coil is brought near it, the coil can pick up most of the energy before it is lost, even if it is some distance away. The fields used are predominately non-radiative, near field (sometimes called evanescent waves), as all hardware is kept well within the 1/4 wavelength distance they radiate little energy from the transmitter to infinity.

One of the applications of the resonant transformer is for the CCFL inverter. Another application of the resonant transformer is to couple between stages of a superheterodyne receiver, where the selectivity of the receiver is provided by tuned transformers in the intermediate-frequency amplifiers.[1] Resonant transformers such as the Tesla coil can generate very high voltages with or without arcing, and are able to provide much higher current than electrostatic high-voltage generation machines such as the Van de Graaff generator.[2] Resonant energy transfer is the operating principle behind proposed short range wireless electricity systems such as WiTricity and systems that have already been deployed, such as passive RFID tags and contactless smart cards.

Cheers,
JP

hi folks,

very good idea with the "tesla transformer". With that device, very high voltages are reachable. But in Stanley Meyers circuits, there is no capacity on the primary side... or, have someone seen a resonant circuit on the primary of the VIC?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_coil#Tuning_precautions

Tuning precautions
 
The primary coil's resonant frequency is tuned to that of the secondary, using low-power oscillations, then increasing the power until the apparatus has been brought under control. While tuning, a small projection (called a "breakout bump") is often added to the top terminal in order to stimulate corona and spark discharges (sometimes called streamers) into the surrounding air. Tuning can then be adjusted so as to achieve the longest streamers at a given power level, corresponding to a frequency match between the primary and secondary coil. Capacitive 'loading' by the streamers tends to lower the resonant frequency of a Tesla coil operating under full power. For a variety of technical reasons,[citation needed] toroids provide one of the most effective shapes for the top terminals of Tesla coils.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Tesla_coil_3.svg&page=1


 

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 5th, 2012, 05:32 PM

Nice video about inductors, resistance, resonance, and energy propagation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

Here is one of Woodside's on LC circuit, VIC, and wave forms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-x3PVi8wF0&feature=related

And from irondmax wave forms on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC3X98TJuBY&feature=endscreen&NR=1

Hope this helps out there.
JP

Thanks for sharing, JP.

The first clip was the most interesting, I have to try that one myself.
The second clip was just confusing (to me anyway) and the last would have been
more interesting to see together with the rest of the circuit, or atleast showing
input current and voltage together with gas output volumeflow from the WFC if
there's some copyright thing the clipowner wants to protect.
Unfortunately there's far too many clips out there showing something that which I
just as easily could have come up with on an experiment board, using common
electronics only, not something put together as a whole system, including pulse
generator + VIC + WFC etc.

Keep up the good work!!

Quote from Lynx on October 7th, 2012, 01:55 AM

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 5th, 2012, 05:32 PM

Nice video about inductors, resistance, resonance, and energy propagation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

Here is one of Woodside's on LC circuit, VIC, and wave forms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-x3PVi8wF0&feature=related

And from irondmax wave forms on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC3X98TJuBY&feature=endscreen&NR=1

Hope this helps out there.
JP

Thanks for sharing, JP.

The first clip was the most interesting, I have to try that one myself.
The second clip was just confusing (to me anyway) and the last would have been
more interesting to see together with the rest of the circuit, or atleast showing
input current and voltage together with gas output volumeflow from the WFC if
there's some copyright thing the clipowner wants to protect.
Unfortunately there's far too many clips out there showing something that which I
just as easily could have come up with on an experiment board, using common
electronics only, not something put together as a whole system, including pulse
generator + VIC + WFC etc.

Keep up the good work!!

first video ,that great.

i try to test this circuit.P(in)=937mV*37.5mA,P(out)=2.97V*37.5mA.this is multi sim11???is real??overunity on multisim???

thanks
geenee

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 04:01 AM

first video ,that great.

i try to test this circuit.P(in)=937mV*37.5mA,P(out)=2.97V*37.5mA.this is multi sim11???is real??overunity on multisim???

thanks
geenee

I'm pretty sure that your simulation program is overly enthusiastic if it shows
overunity in the circuit.
Either that or you're not calculating the (active) effects properly, it's kinda hard
to interpret what kinds of voltages and currents your program shows there.

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 04:01 AM

first video ,that great.

i try to test this circuit.P(in)=937mV*37.5mA,P(out)=2.97V*37.5mA.this is multi sim11???is real??overunity on multisim???

thanks
geenee

Hy, no OU in the Simulation. You have an overall input of 12V RMS and and 37,5mA RMS. The measured voltage is over the lamp. Also on the secondary side.

regards

Oh!! Sorry - -*

I'm just learning in basic electronic.i forgot overall Voltage and overall Power(in).Great Amsy,thanks for suggestion.i will make a real test.this's first test on simulator.

replicate,this's video. tortuga0303's video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

thanks all
geenee

Quote from Amsy on October 7th, 2012, 01:15 AM

hi folks,

very good idea with the "tesla transformer". With that device, very high voltages are reachable. But in Stanley Meyers circuits, there is no capacity on the primary side... or, have someone seen a resonant circuit on the primary of the VIC?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_coil#Tuning_precautions

Tuning precautions
 
The primary coil's resonant frequency is tuned to that of the secondary, using low-power oscillations, then increasing the power until the apparatus has been brought under control. While tuning, a small projection (called a "breakout bump") is often added to the top terminal in order to stimulate corona and spark discharges (sometimes called streamers) into the surrounding air. Tuning can then be adjusted so as to achieve the longest streamers at a given power level, corresponding to a frequency match between the primary and secondary coil. Capacitive 'loading' by the streamers tends to lower the resonant frequency of a Tesla coil operating under full power. For a variety of technical reasons,[citation needed] toroids provide one of the most effective shapes for the top terminals of Tesla coils.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Tesla_coil_3.svg&page=1

My reason for saying "tesla coil" is because Stan stated to me that a Tesla coil is part of the circuit and process.
The description of the inductive coupling on Wiki seems to match what you want in the Meyer circuit, ie. resonance. Wiki also mentions the Fluorescent light fixture as having the type of coupling coil that people try to use for a basic Meyer circuit.
Somewhere on the net there is a story that Stephen Meyer discovered the process of splitting the water after knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water.
I know for a fact that something like this happened as Stan told me, "I didn't  discover the circuit. My brother did." He told me that Stephen "Doesn't want anything to with making hydrogen and saving the world."
As we all know Stephen was very helpful in building and testing systems but he really didn't care for the fame and fortune involved.

A search of "inductive canceling" doesn't really even provide any explanations.

Cheers,
JP

Quote from Lynx on October 7th, 2012, 01:55 AM

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 5th, 2012, 05:32 PM

Nice video about inductors, resistance, resonance, and energy propagation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQdcwDCBoNY

Here is one of Woodside's on LC circuit, VIC, and wave forms.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-x3PVi8wF0&feature=related

And from irondmax wave forms on youtube.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jC3X98TJuBY&feature=endscreen&NR=1

Hope this helps out there.
JP

Thanks for sharing, JP.

The first clip was the most interesting, I have to try that one myself.
The second clip was just confusing (to me anyway) and the last would have been
more interesting to see together with the rest of the circuit, or atleast showing
input current and voltage together with gas output volumeflow from the WFC if
there's some copyright thing the clipowner wants to protect.
Unfortunately there's far too many clips out there showing something that which I
just as easily could have come up with on an experiment board, using common
electronics only, not something put together as a whole system, including pulse
generator + VIC + WFC etc.

Keep up the good work!!

I realize some of these videos lack enough information to be of great value but I post them to keep people thinking and seeing other experimenters ideas that might hint at a good direction to follow. They may have more going than they are showing too.
I too want to see exact measures of power in, power to the cell, and gas/btu/watt outputs.
That is the only way to measure success.

Cheers,
JP

thanks for great suggestion,JP.

about word" Inductive Canceling".i don't know its name.that 's my word - -*.because when connect that way ,inductance is low(2 wires-canceling magnetic field).

Great history about "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water".All this's IMPORTANCE for first step to go to success understanding.

Great all,
geenee

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 12:01 PM

thanks for great suggestion,JP.

about word" Inductive Canceling".i don't know its name.that 's my word - -*.because when connect that way ,inductance is low(2 wires-canceling magnetic field).

Great history about "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water".All this's IMPORTANCE for first step to go to success understanding.

Great all,
geenee

LOL
Thanks for the diagram, awesome :D

Quote from Lynx on October 7th, 2012, 12:47 PM

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 12:01 PM

thanks for great suggestion,JP.

about word" Inductive Canceling".i don't know its name.that 's my word - -*.because when connect that way ,inductance is low(2 wires-canceling magnetic field).

Great history about "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water".All this's IMPORTANCE for first step to go to success understanding.

Great all,
geenee

LOL
Thanks for the diagram, awesome :D

So geenee, what about if the wire lengths are unequal?  What sort of bifilar coils are they then?

It's rough to compete with geenee, but I gave it a shot.  See attached.   :P

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 7th, 2012, 11:11 AM

My reason for saying "tesla coil" is because Stan stated to me that a Tesla coil is part of the circuit and process.
The description of the inductive coupling on Wiki seems to match what you want in the Meyer circuit, ie. resonance. Wiki also mentions the Fluorescent light fixture as having the type of coupling coil that people try to use for a basic Meyer circuit.
Somewhere on the net there is a story that Stephen Meyer discovered the process of splitting the water after knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water.
I know for a fact that something like this happened as Stan told me, "I didn't  discover the circuit. My brother did." He told me that Stephen "Doesn't want anything to with making hydrogen and saving the world."
As we all know Stephen was very helpful in building and testing systems but he really didn't care for the fame and fortune involved.

A search of "inductive canceling" doesn't really even provide any explanations.

Cheers,
JP

Hy! Good to see, that you can remember a lot of things!:exclamation: :idea: ;)
Did he mean with flourescent light something like this?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_fluorescent_lamp

Most of them do have something like this inside
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverter_%28electrical%29 (generally)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_inverter
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CCFL_inverter

Different types are listet on the right side of Wiki. You see that the resonance transformer can work out of resonance (old one), in a harmonic frequency of the secondary side or at exactly the same frequency. Which one can the VIC be? Whatever, generating a high voltage should not be the problem.

But this is a good hint I think, unfortunately doesn´t solve the problem, how it is possible to generate a hugh electrical field (high voltage) between the electrodes immersed in water without electrolyses:
Generating a high voltage isn´t the problem IMHO (many types of circuits are good for it). But this works in lamps and air (ozon generator,...).
In water, there is the problem of the "pollution" of different minerals like iron. So a lot of free ions are in the water. The ions cause electrolyses. Ok, we can stop electrolyses with a big resistor or a big coil, but then also the voltage in the Water Cell will be lowered. See the different posts of users which can only perform ~10V to the cell.

Edit:
An other theorie is, that after a little google search, a CFL (flourescent lamp) works with mercury inside. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_%28element%29 (Danger, it is a toxic material)
Lamps with mercury inside emits light in wide spectrum also a  very strong UV wave. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultraviolet
The UV wave emitted works with a frequency of ~10^12.

We know also that UV LED were used in Meyers device.... UV LEDs are available from ~380 to ~450 nm wavelenght.

Maybe UV waves are the key??
Maybe the electrodes work like an antenna for the UV waves. Would this be possible? Are there radio engineers in this forum ??:D
It is possible, that a harmonic frequency can also work.:exclamation:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoelectric_effect

regards

Quote from Dog-One on October 7th, 2012, 04:27 PM

Quote from Lynx on October 7th, 2012, 12:47 PM

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 12:01 PM

thanks for great suggestion,JP.

about word" Inductive Canceling".i don't know its name.that 's my word - -*.because when connect that way ,inductance is low(2 wires-canceling magnetic field).

Great history about "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water".All this's IMPORTANCE for first step to go to success understanding.

Great all,
geenee

LOL
Thanks for the diagram, awesome :D

So geenee, what about if the wire lengths are unequal?  What sort of bifilar coils are they then?

It's rough to compete with geenee, but I gave it a shot.  See attached.   :P

i tested two types of bifilar(used normal home power electric wire).use LCR meter to measure.

1.connection type-inductive canceling bifilar,inductance is low about 0.007mH

2.connection type-inductive coupling bifilar,inductance is high about 0.316mH

3.connection type-single wire,inductance = 0.070mH

-about if the wire lengths are unequal.if connection type 1. i think "inductance is not low because flux line doesn't cancel".

-next step,i will try "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water",and see what happen???

PS.sorry about my language.
thanks all
geenee  
 

Quote from geenee on October 7th, 2012, 11:26 PM

-next step,i will try "knocking a fluorescent light into a tank of water",and see what happen???

OK let´s do this :)
But be carefull with the electrical connection, don´t put in the high voltage (120/230V) in the water! :exclamation:
Only try to see what happens when the lighttubes are immersed in the water.