Yes, lets not forget about all the vehicles people turned in, then were destroyed by you know who, so people could get a tax break to buy a new car. Now the newer junked cars are few and far between. They called it an incentive program,"not". Thanks Nate and JP for your posts.:D

Quote from firepinto on September 26th, 2012, 03:47 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 26th, 2012, 10:15 AM

After he demonstrated this with his basic cell they never came back and what they did then was make all the cars more complicated to retrofit with Water Fuel Cells by adding all the anti-pollution devices, injectors, and computerization to essentially run away from Stan's technical and financial ability to easily retrofit all existing cars. Stan would have been better off at that point to build a whole new vehicle platform using Water Fuel Cells for power.

"Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition."
Cheers,
JP

JP, Thank you for joining the forum.:cool:  I think the quote above is totally correct and has been happening since they designed oxygen sensors in exhaust systems.  Now they go as far as controlling transmission and other vehicle systems all in the same computer.  Replacing the computer with a water friendly one will be difficult in a lot of cases, as it will have to control braking, shifting, throttle, and now even electronic steering.  
I think the easiest first applications for water fuel will be kit cars or open source platforms such as Wikispeed.  I think water fuel will be an exotic market until the manufacturing / dealer infrastructure is completed.  Seeing home built cars running on water would draw investors to the manufacturing table though.:)

Nate

Thanks for the welcome and happy to be here.
In my opinion getting some type of usable product to the market that many can use is a good start.
This to me the includes basic cells and circuits for schools and experimental study.
Much of this is available but there needs to be some specific "How to Build" publications as well.
Beyond that I think making the cell and good gas production is secondary to having a device on which to use the thermal energy. I am looking for some "off the shelf" steam pumps that can belt drive small and large electric generators for off grid use. The off grid community is growing rapidly and many preppers would jump at the chance to have the ability to create energy from any type of dirty water as well as having purified water left over.
I have been trying to find a maybe 5HP steam engine similar to the small toy ones (link) you see just to use it to close the loop after priming and getting up enough steam to run the alternator doing the water decomposition with the very basic 8xa process and nothing more than a cell the size Stan demonstrated. These kits and systems can be sold for much less than $10,000 I believe.
http://www.ebay.com/sch/Tools-Supplies-Engines-/2594/i.html?_nkw=toy+steam+engine
This would also CLEARLY demonstrate that if you have the water "fuel" supply that you truly have the "free energy" about which Stan spoke.
Demonstrating these simple closed loop (except for adding more water) systems is far easier and will generate more investor interest for systems development than a 1-off vintage carbureted "Water Powered Car" because it is something people can buy today without going to the junk yard for a 1966 Falcon.
Until someone designs and produces a transportation platform designed specifically to use the Water Fuel Cell tech base everything will be 1-off retrofits of some easier cars than others but nothing will be available for the masses because of the discussed complications of todays autos. I am told that the computers on these cars are specifically setup to sabotage themselves by any attempt to alter the software or add on devices that don't operate as they were manufactured.

Those are just my ideas for what anyone of us could do with a basic cell and and 8xa setup once you can get the "choking" circuit and tubing to use the gases safely to run a small steam engine. This one looks interesting but likely too small.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Stuart-Turner-Steam-Engine-Model-10V-with-Wooden-Base-BEAUTIFUL-/360491374300?pt=Vintage_Antique_Toys_US&hash=item53eef5d6dc
This simple generator design might be easy to retrofit and size up?

How much power does a house use daily?
You have to be using electricity too.
Of course thats the EPG side of the tech base needed to truly have the system be a 'disconnect' in the sense of your gas, heat, and electric are in these same package
The original Canadian patent included the water splitting and EPG as you can see.

Stan designed simple stove and hydrogen "burner" gas mixing concepts for patents but not much is standardized that could be built any more like 50 or 100 years ago. There are too many models of every appliance burners. Easier to buy a new one built for Water as Fuel. Homes must be built new or retrofitted WFC  systems until we build KW and MW power systems that stand alone. This is a huge undertaking. Look how much a basic cell build is. Mine could be sold for less than $1000 even massed produced. Maybe design a Water Fuel Cell Oven that runs on water? It has to be plug and play. Make a steam oven that steams veggies. This type of development takes years even without most everyone being still experimenting rather than using what we know in practice and yet we still need to learn to recreate much less APPLY more Stan's very advanced processes.

Everyone should be thinking about making retrofits for common things or they must build a new platform for anything using the tech base.
They also must make money to do this to improve and promote the tech base knowledge. You do this by showing people how they can use what we have. Right now we have the basics that Stan demonstrated to varying degrees.
This all must be promoted to create demand.
One goes hand in hand with the other.
We aren't getting any free advertising on the "Networks" for a reason.
This needs to be brought into the educational complex. It sure would be an American and world wide job creator too.
Using a Water Fuel Cell has to be nearly as convenient as the most convenient thing existing today and be price competitive to succeed.  If the demand for oil goes down WFC tech will still have to out convenience the last best thing as gas goes back down to 25 CENTS a gallon.  Stan's technology could again be used by the oil industry to cut it's OWN energy costs. Super heated steam injection is a major component is reviving old thick bottomed oil wells.

It will be 50-100 years before anything resembling the large percent of the world is running "on water" but that is just a blip in history. This is especially in light of any suppression and any subversion and non-public investment by the elites. You can bet the likes of the petroleum company owners themselves, the military, and others have been playing with this technology since the day Meyer filed those patents. Bet on it.  Where do you think the 1.2 TRILLION dollars Rumsfield says "Is unaccounted for in the Pentagram budget" the  VERY day BEFORE 9-11? It has already been more than 27 years since Meyer began to create and disseminate his work and look where we "the public" are with it. The money power is the oil based war machine over "scarce" resources that we really waste by burning instead of turning to plastics or just leave in the damn ground. They still control 100% of the market in energy use.

Anyways, to carry on.
We can and MUST get some serious devices to market in 5 years by the millions by demonstrating the technology, getting IO data and building "daily use' products small and large. All this again will take millions and billions of dollars.

The "public" knows we are up a creek on this planet without this type of clean advances in technology. They will demand it if they know about it and see it working. Invent daily use devices. A camp stove, mini gen set, or wind powered gas generator that runs a steam engine/electrical generator.
This generation has more technology and knowledge available at its" fingertips than ever in known history with "desk top" part printing CAD, and things I never dreamed of as a child building balsa wood and plastic airplanes.

Carry on.
Dream on.
Work on.
Here are our first pictures and videos.

Vayas con Dios,
JP
[attachment=2290][attachment=2291][attachment=2292][attachment=2293]

Hi JP, good to have you here.

Must have been a very frustrating 20 years for you, knowing that this was sitting under people's noses this whole time and being summarily ignored and dismissed.  Congratulations on staying in the fight long enough for the re-inforcements to start showing up.

We have some very talented builders and experimenters on here (and people like myself who watch and try to encourage and inject the odd thought here and there).  I think between us all we also raise awareness in those around us which can only be good.

I feel that we are close to success in many areas and when that success comes, well, we know there is no putting the genie back in the bottle.  As you say though, we need to get that success and start having practical demonstrations of this technology making lives easier and better.

Great JP.you make it happen.welcome to be here.

thanks
geenee

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

Welcome JP!  I enjoyed reading your posts, it was a great history lesson and very inspirational.  I'm looking forward to hearing more from you, and good luck with your endeavors.    

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 06:56 AM

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

I have a 8xa and 9xa board and components sent to my by Josh at stansdream.com.
He sent all this to me gratis as well as $50 for more supplies after I spoke to him on the phone, telling him of my association with Stan and my desire to FINALLY have a Meyer replication circuit/cell after all these years.
The 8xa fully built board was all ready to solder to my RCC, connect to the step down transformer, variac, and capacitor tubes. This can all be seen in the photos (sorry about focus) attached here. I guess it is his own board design based on Stan's Memo 420 diagram attached.
He also sent me the 9xa PCB and all the other components to solder together for that board. I hope to get my technician or another protege to solder that board together for testing soon for testing too. My understanding is the 9xa board is needed to actually get beyond basic Electrical Polarization Process and create resonance for Resonant Cavity increased gas production.
We are near done with the 9 tube exciter array and assembly. I has taken a few months to get components purchased, machined, and welded with my minimal budget and current cash flow. This is my cost list so far.

WFC Cost as of Sept 27, 2012   
$1724.36   Total

Free    8xA Complet PCB (Sells for $350.00 @ stansdream.com)   

7.32   12v/450mA Step down transformer (Radio Shack sku# 4029312665)
56   Variac (Used on Ebay)
11.79   18g copper wire
3.9   bolt tool for winding RCC as per youtube video
55.51   nts-blts (Stainless nuts and bolts for assembly)
44.61   switches (9 switches/Stan's original panel)
150   Labor Machining
50   SSteel strips for outside exciter connections 25 thou thickness
137   SSteel 304 Tubes www.metalsdepot.com
305.86   plastic tube, top/bottom, base material www.interstateplastics.com
15.82   Taps for Delrin screws to space/insulate outer exciter tube
16.5   2 E-cores www.surplussales.com/Inductors/FerPotC/FerPotC-2.html
10   SSteel plate for round inner exciter base/holder
500   Caps/Tube Labor Machining
200   Top and bottom exciter align plates Labor Machining
15   1 ft Al channel for switch and plug plate on base
25.05   plug jump cord /wire end connectors, rubber feet for base
120   Lbor Machining Base-bottotm cell plug

So at this point I would have spent a total of more than $2,000 if I had to pay for the 8xa board. I know some of this could be done cheaper a different way but again I want to near as possible replicate Stan's cell for lecture and historical purposes. I still plan to house the components in a nice box with meters.
I will get my tabs welded onto the outer exciter tubes soon for free by my technician. I was getting my machining at something of a discount rate by a friend.

I really should start a new "Project" thread here to share all this.

And Jeff, I loaded 2 videos as attachments in another post and didn't see them attached?
What should I do?

[attachment=2294][attachment=2295][attachment=2296][attachment=2297][attachment=2298]

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 10:06 AM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 06:56 AM

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

I have a 8xa and 9xa board and components sent to my by Josh at stansdream.com.
He sent all this to me gratis as well as $50 for more supplies after I spoke to him on the phone, telling him of my association with Stan and my desire to FINALLY have a Meyer replication circuit/cell after all these years.
The 8xa fully built board was all ready to solder to my RCC, connect to the step down transformer, variac, and capacitor tubes. This can all be seen in the photos (sorry about focus) attached here. I guess it is his own board design based on Stan's Memo 420 diagram attached.
He also sent me the 9xa PCB and all the other components to solder together for that board. I hope to get my technician or another protege to solder that board together for testing soon for testing too. My understanding is the 9xa board is needed to actually get beyond basic Electrical Polarization Process and create resonance for Resonant Cavity increased gas production.
We are near done with the 9 tube exciter array and assembly. I has taken a few months to get components purchased, machined, and welded with my minimal budget and current cash flow. This is my cost list so far.

WFC Cost as of Sept 27, 2012   
$1724.36   Total

Free    8xA Complet PCB (Sells for $350.00 @ stansdream.com)   

7.32   12v/450mA Step down transformer (Radio Shack sku# 4029312665)
56   Variac (Used on Ebay)
11.79   18g copper wire
3.9   bolt tool for winding RCC as per youtube video
55.51   nts-blts (Stainless nuts and bolts for assembly)
44.61   switches (9 switches/Stan's original panel)
150   Labor Machining
50   SSteel strips for outside exciter connections 25 thou thickness
137   SSteel 304 Tubes www.metalsdepot.com
305.86   plastic tube, top/bottom, base material www.interstateplastics.com
15.82   Taps for Delrin screws to space/insulate outer exciter tube
16.5   2 E-cores www.surplussales.com/Inductors/FerPotC/FerPotC-2.html
10   SSteel plate for round inner exciter base/holder
500   Caps/Tube Labor Machining
200   Top and bottom exciter align plates Labor Machining
15   1 ft Al channel for switch and plug plate on base
25.05   plug jump cord /wire end connectors, rubber feet for base
120   Lbor Machining Base-bottotm cell plug

So at this point I would have spent a total of more than $2,000 if I had to pay for the 8xa board. I know some of this could be done cheaper a different way but again I want to near as possible replicate Stan's cell for lecture and historical purposes. I still plan to house the components in a nice box with meters.
I will get my tabs welded onto the outer exciter tubes soon for free by my technician. I was getting my machining at something of a discount rate by a friend.

I really should start a new "Project" thread here to share all this.

And Jeff, I loaded 2 videos as attachments in another post and didn't see them attached?
What should I do?

Some good web sites you posted thanks, and for posting videos, look to the top right of where you type in your post, you will see a little blue tv looking icon, left click on it, this will bring up a selection window, left click on Youtube, this will bring up another window to where you can then copy and paste the link into, then click ok, at that point when you are done typing your post, you just post your reply as you normally would and the video should be there. Try this and let me know how it will work for you, thanks Jeff.:D

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 11:46 AM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 10:06 AM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 06:56 AM

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

I have a 8xa and 9xa board and components sent to my by Josh at stansdream.com.
He sent all this to me gratis as well as $50 for more supplies after I spoke to him on the phone, telling him of my association with Stan and my desire to FINALLY have a Meyer replication circuit/cell after all these years.

(Economy snip)

And Jeff, I loaded 2 videos as attachments in another post and didn't see them attached?
What should I do?

Some good web sites you posted thanks, and for posting videos, look to the top right of where you type in your post, you will see a little blue tv looking icon, left click on it, this will bring up a selection window, left click on Youtube, this will bring up another window to where you can then copy and paste the link into, then click ok, at that point when you are done typing your post, you just post your reply as you normally would and the video should be there. Try this and let me know how it will work for you, thanks Jeff.:D

Jeff,
I don't have a youtube account so would like to load the videos as downloadable files tagged to posts here if that is doable.
How would I do this?

Thanks,
JP

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 12:21 PM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 11:46 AM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 10:06 AM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 06:56 AM

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

I have a 8xa and 9xa board and components sent to my by Josh at stansdream.com.
He sent all this to me gratis as well as $50 for more supplies after I spoke to him on the phone, telling him of my association with Stan and my desire to FINALLY have a Meyer replication circuit/cell after all these years.

(Economy snip)

And Jeff, I loaded 2 videos as attachments in another post and didn't see them attached?
What should I do?

Some good web sites you posted thanks, and for posting videos, look to the top right of where you type in your post, you will see a little blue tv looking icon, left click on it, this will bring up a selection window, left click on Youtube, this will bring up another window to where you can then copy and paste the link into, then click ok, at that point when you are done typing your post, you just post your reply as you normally would and the video should be there. Try this and let me know how it will work for you, thanks Jeff.:D

Jeff,
I don't have a youtube account so would like to load the videos as downloadable files tagged to posts here if that is doable.
How would I do this?

Thanks,
JP

Have you tried loading the video same as you would a photo, If that won't work, I think you will need to zip the video then load the zipped version the same as you would a photo.:D

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 01:13 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 12:21 PM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 11:46 AM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 27th, 2012, 10:06 AM

Quote from Jeff Nading on September 27th, 2012, 06:56 AM

Yes symanuk, my sentiments exactly, again thanks JP. We really need to come up with a working model, so with that being said, do you JP have the original working 8XA circuit that Stan designed or are you working with the same one found on the internet that we all have ?:cool::D:P

I have a 8xa and 9xa board and components sent to my by Josh at stansdream.com.
He sent all this to me gratis as well as $50 for more supplies after I spoke to him on the phone, telling him of my association with Stan and my desire to FINALLY have a Meyer replication circuit/cell after all these years.

(Economy snip)

And Jeff, I loaded 2 videos as attachments in another post and didn't see them attached?
What should I do?

Some good web sites you posted thanks, and for posting videos, look to the top right of where you type in your post, you will see a little blue tv looking icon, left click on it, this will bring up a selection window, left click on Youtube, this will bring up another window to where you can then copy and paste the link into, then click ok, at that point when you are done typing your post, you just post your reply as you normally would and the video should be there. Try this and let me know how it will work for you, thanks Jeff.:D

Jeff,
I don't have a youtube account so would like to load the videos as downloadable files tagged to posts here if that is doable.
How would I do this?

Thanks,
JP

Have you tried loading the video same as you would a photo, If that won't work, I think you will need to zip the video then load the zipped version the same as you would a photo.:D

Yes, tried to load normally and it appeared to succeed or time out.
The biggest one was 8.2 MB or so.
I don't see them listed in my account attachment list.
I have yet to master my zipping and loading but will try that after I try one more time the other way attaching in original post.
Thanks,
JP

Hi JP, VERY welcome to the forum :D
I hope to be able to build one of these and during that process I also hope that you won't mind
me asking (a few) questions, should they arise :P
I'm going to use this as a starting point, quoted from your earlier post,

Quote

HOW TO?

As a guide, you need US Patent 4,936,961 ref. figure 1 to 3F.

If you read something about magical frequencyis, forget that.
It works fine with 10KHz or something else if you preferred.
Use 50% duty cycle. BUT! the frequency will be doubled in the
step up circuit and that's the frequency the Water-Cell will work
with. The components must resist at least 2000V.

The Water-Cell is very simple. Take a lot of stainless steel tubes
with the inner diameter of the bigger tube 3mm bigger than the outer
diameter of the inner tube. From now you must look at this
Water-Cell as a capacitor with water as dilectricum.

The Water-Cell and the INDUCTOR will resonate at a specific
frequency. It's a normal RC-circuit.

Now the most important: The Water-Cell/Inductor frequency and
the doubled frequency from the generator must be exactly the
same. A special condition exists in a L/C Circuit, when it is
energized at a frequency at which the inductive reactance is equal
to the capacitive reactance, XL = XC.

Adjust the voltage peak level to reach a maximum hydrogen/oxygen
producing with a minimum of current using. If you earlier make
hydrogen with the electrolysis method with a lot of current,
this experiment will really surprise you.

For even less current you can make some experiment with a
centertapped puls-transformer.

Thanks!Oh what the heck, here goes.
So I start by putting together a single cell with 1.5 mm spacing (air gap) between the tubes.
First question: Do I have to prime the tubes by applying a dielectric layer on the outside of
the inner tube and on the inside of the outer tube?
The reason for asking is because I suspect that when you apply anything up to 1 KV on a cell
submerged in water, surely that would then result in some serious current flowing from one
tube to the other, unless there's some form of dielectric "barrier" preventing an electric current
from flowing?
This would explain the "no current, all voltage" approach to a working cell.
Next, I build a VIC according to protocol, with bifilar wound secondarys, including a high voltage
rectifier diode, and so on.
Then I apply a 50% duty cycle PWM pulse train to the primary of the VIC, at a fairly low voltage,
and at the same time I observe how the secondary looks like on my oscilloscope.
When (if) I see the double frequency I know at what frequency the cell should operate at.
Then I crank up the voltage until I get the highest flow of hydogen & oxygen from the cell without
breaking the dielectric barrier on the tubes, or draining the cavity between the tubes due to
the high volumeflow of gasses being produced in the cell.

How far off am I in my thinking here? :D

Btw, I put together a PDF with your description and the patent 4936961

Quote from Lynx on September 29th, 2012, 08:15 AM

Hi JP, VERY welcome to the forum :D
I hope to be able to build one of these and during that process I also hope that you won't mind
me asking (a few) questions, should they arise :P
I'm going to use this as a starting point, quoted from your earlier post,

Quote

HOW TO?

As a guide, you need US Patent 4,936,961 ref. figure 1 to 3F.

If you read something about magical frequencyis, forget that.
It works fine with 10KHz or something else if you preferred.
Use 50% duty cycle. BUT! the frequency will be doubled in the
step up circuit and that's the frequency the Water-Cell will work
with. The components must resist at least 2000V.

The Water-Cell is very simple. Take a lot of stainless steel tubes
with the inner diameter of the bigger tube 3mm bigger than the outer
diameter of the inner tube. From now you must look at this
Water-Cell as a capacitor with water as dilectricum.

The Water-Cell and the INDUCTOR will resonate at a specific
frequency. It's a normal RC-circuit.

Now the most important: The Water-Cell/Inductor frequency and
the doubled frequency from the generator must be exactly the
same. A special condition exists in a L/C Circuit, when it is
energized at a frequency at which the inductive reactance is equal
to the capacitive reactance, XL = XC.

Adjust the voltage peak level to reach a maximum hydrogen/oxygen
producing with a minimum of current using. If you earlier make
hydrogen with the electrolysis method with a lot of current,
this experiment will really surprise you.

For even less current you can make some experiment with a
centertapped puls-transformer.

Thanks!
Oh what the heck, here goes.
So I start by putting together a single cell with 1.5 mm spacing (air gap) between the tubes.
First question: Do I have to prime the tubes by applying a dielectric layer on the outside of
the inner tube and on the inside of the outer tube?
The reason for asking is because I suspect that when you apply anything up to 1 KV on a cell
submerged in water, surely that would then result in some serious current flowing from one
tube to the other, unless there's some form of dielectric "barrier" preventing an electric current
from flowing?
This would explain the "no current, all voltage" approach to a working cell.
Next, I build a VIC according to protocol, with bifilar wound secondarys, including a high voltage
rectifier diode, and so on.
Then I apply a 50% duty cycle PWM pulse train to the primary of the VIC, at a fairly low voltage,
and at the same time I observe how the secondary looks like on my oscilloscope.
When (if) I see the double frequency I know at what frequency the cell should operate at.
Then I crank up the voltage until I get the highest flow of hydogen & oxygen from the cell without
breaking the dielectric barrier on the tubes, or draining the cavity between the tubes due to
the high volumeflow of gasses being produced in the cell.

How far off am I in my thinking here? :D

Btw, I put together a PDF with your description and the patent 4936961

Ok, as far as I know the water is the dielectric. It is suffering "catastrophic breakdown" (Peter Lindeman's term) due to the high voltage and frequency. None of Stan's tubes or anything else (resonant cavity) that I know of had any "coatings." Stan stressed that the Stainless 304 is "totally inert" and does not chemically react in the cell. Stan always stressed in his explanations that the dielectric constant was key in his process. What he was stressing is that you can beak down the dielectric medium with voltage and high frequency without the consumption of "appreciable amounts of current." The secret, as it were, is in matching or exceeding the capacitance with the inductance allowing voltage to take over as the primary force in the decomposition of the water. This creates the polarization field, as it were, of great potential difference and then the vibration is added. In electrolysis, it seems to me, electrons are converted into heat with the passage of current (friction) in taking the molecule apart by brute force of current. In Electrical Polarization we are "liberating" each and every component of the molecule without converting any electrons to heat. The stretching of the molecule with the large potential differences and vibratory frequencies make it impossible for the electrons to maintain their orbits and the molecule falls apart. We then collect the HHO and free electrons to do more work elsewhere.
All I know is you are tuning the circuit to make the Inductance match or exceed the capacitance. Ted did the experiment in the most basic way I've seen explained.

I can't tell you what you should see or do with your signal on your scope.
Alex Petty posted this:
http://www.alexpetty.com/2011/06/16/simple-wfc-energization-circuit-by-alex-petty/
I am not literate in using a scope myself.
I hope there are others here that will be able to explain more about what you should see and do from here.

I hope this helps.
Nice job on the pdf.
Good luck in your experiments.

Cheers,
JP

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 29th, 2012, 12:55 PM

Ok, as far as I know the water is the dielectric. It is suffering "catastrophic breakdown" (Peter Lindeman's term) due to the high voltage and frequency. None of Stan's tubes or anything else (resonant cavity) that I know of had any "coatings." Stan stressed that the Stainless 304 is "totally inert" and does not chemically react in the cell. Stan always stressed in his explanations that the dielectric constant was key in his process. What he was stressing is that you can beak down the dielectric medium with voltage and high frequency without the consumption of "appreciable amounts of current." The secret, as it were, is in matching or exceeding the capacitance with the inductance allowing voltage to take over as the primary force in the decomposition of the water. This creates the polarization field, as it were, of great potential difference and then the vibration is added. In electrolysis, it seems to me, electrons are converted into heat with the passage of current (friction) in taking the molecule apart by brute force of current. In Electrical Polarization we are "liberating" each and every component of the molecule without converting any electrons to heat. The stretching of the molecule with the large potential differences and vibratory frequencies make it impossible for the electrons to maintain their orbits and the molecule falls apart. We then collect the HHO and free electrons to do more work elsewhere.
All I know is you are tuning the circuit to make the Inductance match or exceed the capacitance. Ted did the experiment in the most basic way I've seen explained.

I can't tell you what you should see or do with your signal on your scope.
Alex Petty posted this:
http://www.alexpetty.com/2011/06/16/simple-wfc-energization-circuit-by-alex-petty/
I am not literate in using a scope myself.
I hope there are others here that will be able to explain more about what you should see and do from here.

I hope this helps.
Nice job on the pdf.
Good luck in your experiments.

Cheers,
JP

Excellent, thank you very much :D

Quote from Lynx on September 29th, 2012, 02:01 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 29th, 2012, 12:55 PM

Ok, as far as I know the water is the dielectric. It is suffering "catastrophic breakdown" (Peter Lindeman's term) due to the high voltage and frequency. None of Stan's tubes or anything else (resonant cavity) that I know of had any "coatings." Stan stressed that the Stainless 304 is "totally inert" and does not chemically react in the cell. Stan always stressed in his explanations that the dielectric constant was key in his process. What he was stressing is that you can beak down the dielectric medium with voltage and high frequency without the consumption of "appreciable amounts of current." The secret, as it were, is in matching or exceeding the capacitance with the inductance allowing voltage to take over as the primary force in the decomposition of the water. This creates the polarization field, as it were, of great potential difference and then the vibration is added. In electrolysis, it seems to me, electrons are converted into heat with the passage of current (friction) in taking the molecule apart by brute force of current. In Electrical Polarization we are "liberating" each and every component of the molecule without converting any electrons to heat. The stretching of the molecule with the large potential differences and vibratory frequencies make it impossible for the electrons to maintain their orbits and the molecule falls apart. We then collect the HHO and free electrons to do more work elsewhere.
All I know is you are tuning the circuit to make the Inductance match or exceed the capacitance. Ted did the experiment in the most basic way I've seen explained.

I can't tell you what you should see or do with your signal on your scope.
Alex Petty posted this:
http://www.alexpetty.com/2011/06/16/simple-wfc-energization-circuit-by-alex-petty/
I am not literate in using a scope myself.
I hope there are others here that will be able to explain more about what you should see and do from here.

I hope this helps.
Nice job on the pdf.
Good luck in your experiments.

Cheers,
JP

Excellent, thank you very much :D

This is resonant wave forms and coil video showed up and I just discovered it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NczhXYkK0BI

Good luck,
JP

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 1st, 2012, 12:57 PM

Quote from Lynx on September 29th, 2012, 02:01 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 29th, 2012, 12:55 PM

Ok, as far as I know the water is the dielectric. It is suffering "catastrophic breakdown" (Peter Lindeman's term) due to the high voltage and frequency. None of Stan's tubes or anything else (resonant cavity) that I know of had any "coatings." Stan stressed that the Stainless 304 is "totally inert" and does not chemically react in the cell. Stan always stressed in his explanations that the dielectric constant was key in his process. What he was stressing is that you can beak down the dielectric medium with voltage and high frequency without the consumption of "appreciable amounts of current." The secret, as it were, is in matching or exceeding the capacitance with the inductance allowing voltage to take over as the primary force in the decomposition of the water. This creates the polarization field, as it were, of great potential difference and then the vibration is added. In electrolysis, it seems to me, electrons are converted into heat with the passage of current (friction) in taking the molecule apart by brute force of current. In Electrical Polarization we are "liberating" each and every component of the molecule without converting any electrons to heat. The stretching of the molecule with the large potential differences and vibratory frequencies make it impossible for the electrons to maintain their orbits and the molecule falls apart. We then collect the HHO and free electrons to do more work elsewhere.
All I know is you are tuning the circuit to make the Inductance match or exceed the capacitance. Ted did the experiment in the most basic way I've seen explained.

I can't tell you what you should see or do with your signal on your scope.
Alex Petty posted this:
http://www.alexpetty.com/2011/06/16/simple-wfc-energization-circuit-by-alex-petty/
I am not literate in using a scope myself.
I hope there are others here that will be able to explain more about what you should see and do from here.

I hope this helps.
Nice job on the pdf.
Good luck in your experiments.

Cheers,
JP

Excellent, thank you very much :D

This is resonant wave forms and coil video showed up and I just discovered it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NczhXYkK0BI

Good luck,
JP

Thanks for sharing.
I recall vaguely having seen a similar waveform on my own scope, but still no cigar alas :-/
What would be interesting would be to see this applied on a WFC, with all the correct parameters, a "proper" VIC
and what not, showing a significant difference in performance at resonance compared to 'non' resonance.
Let's hope that it's not too far away.

Quote from MeyerandMe on October 1st, 2012, 12:57 PM

Quote from Lynx on September 29th, 2012, 02:01 PM

Quote from MeyerandMe on September 29th, 2012, 12:55 PM

Ok, as far as I know the water is the dielectric. It is suffering "catastrophic breakdown" (Peter Lindeman's term) due to the high voltage and frequency. None of Stan's tubes or anything else (resonant cavity) that I know of had any "coatings." Stan stressed that the Stainless 304 is "totally inert" and does not chemically react in the cell. Stan always stressed in his explanations that the dielectric constant was key in his process. What he was stressing is that you can beak down the dielectric medium with voltage and high frequency without the consumption of "appreciable amounts of current." The secret, as it were, is in matching or exceeding the capacitance with the inductance allowing voltage to take over as the primary force in the decomposition of the water. This creates the polarization field, as it were, of great potential difference and then the vibration is added. In electrolysis, it seems to me, electrons are converted into heat with the passage of current (friction) in taking the molecule apart by brute force of current. In Electrical Polarization we are "liberating" each and every component of the molecule without converting any electrons to heat. The stretching of the molecule with the large potential differences and vibratory frequencies make it impossible for the electrons to maintain their orbits and the molecule falls apart. We then collect the HHO and free electrons to do more work elsewhere.
All I know is you are tuning the circuit to make the Inductance match or exceed the capacitance. Ted did the experiment in the most basic way I've seen explained.

I can't tell you what you should see or do with your signal on your scope.
Alex Petty posted this:
http://www.alexpetty.com/2011/06/16/simple-wfc-energization-circuit-by-alex-petty/
I am not literate in using a scope myself.
I hope there are others here that will be able to explain more about what you should see and do from here.

I hope this helps.
Nice job on the pdf.
Good luck in your experiments.

Cheers,
JP

Excellent, thank you very much :D

This is resonant wave forms and coil video showed up and I just discovered it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NczhXYkK0BI

Good luck,
JP

Yes JP, this guy won't post anything but this, gives no info and want's to post it 20 times in different threads, not cool.:@:angel:

Hi JP,

Good to see you are involved.  I was away for a couple of months so I missed you coming into the forum, today I read who you are.  Thanks for the info you sent and good luck with the demo unit.

Cheers, Rider

Quote from Rider on November 23rd, 2012, 08:36 AM

Hi JP,

Good to see you are involved.  I was away for a couple of months so I missed you coming into the forum, today I read who you are.  Thanks for the info you sent and good luck with the demo unit.

Cheers, Rider

Thanks.
Be sure to read this other thread for information on my Demo Cell build.
http://open-source-energy.org/?tid=733
We are near complete with the cell itself.
We might be testing circuits and coils later next week.

Cheers,
JP