There are literally hundreds of H-bridge boards on Ebay and other sites but not sure which one would be suitable for me. Basically this is what i'm wanting to do:-
I have a sine wave coming out of a signal generator which I want to input into an H-bridge. The H-bridge will take a 12vdc input and output the sine wave from the signal gen exactly. It has to be fast switching up to 10khz and emulate the input driver signal from the sig gen perfectly.
If I could pick your brains for a cheap solution, I've noticed a lot of H-bridges are designed for a PWM input not a sine wave and are basically used for motors in forward and reverse motion.

Typically when I hear H-bridge I think digital.  What instead it sounds like you are referring to is a class-AB totem pole power amp.  I picked up a couple of these for my experimenting as well as some LM324 all-purpose Op-Amps.  One should be able to produce all sorts of signals with these.  The only real drawback with the LM1875 is that you need to keep the output impedance fairly low, four to eight ohms.  A typical VIC primary is around ten ohms which should be pretty much in the ballpark and avoid any serious distortion.  And always heatsink the LM1875.  It will get hot even with no signal input.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 21st, 2018, 02:16 PM

Typically when I hear H-bridge I think digital.  What instead it sounds like you are referring to is a class-AB totem pole power amp.  I picked up a couple of these for my experimenting as well as some LM324 all-purpose Op-Amps.  One should be able to produce all sorts of signals with these.  The only real drawback with the LM1875 is that you need to keep the output impedance fairly low, four to eight ohms.  A typical VIC primary is around ten ohms which should be pretty much in the ballpark and avoid any serious distortion.  And always heatsink the LM1875.  It will get hot even with no signal input.

I don't need a power amp Matt. My sig gen is like yours, I can output anything I like but only up to 2v max rms, any arbitrary complex waveform i choose. Because its limited to 2v rms i can't input enough voltage into the VIC so I need a dc to ac converter which will take current from my dc power supply and copy the sig gen signal perfectly into higher ac voltage output. So really its an ac to ac signal replicator that takes its current from a dc supply.

Guess I'm confused Nav.  Still sounds like you need an amplifier of sorts.

BTW, my Siglent SDG2042X will output 20 volts peak to peak High-Z or 10 volts peak to peak @ 50 Ohms.  It just won't push much in the way of current, say at one Ohm.  If I have to output to something under 50 Ohms, then I need a pretty significant current boost which I've been able to do with an Op-Amp and MOSFET or just use the power Op-Amp I mentioned above.  Seems to work fine unless I need really fast rise and fall times, which to me we're now talking digital, not analog.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 21st, 2018, 03:36 PM

Guess I'm confused Nav.  Still sounds like you need an amplifier of sorts.

BTW, my Siglent SDG2042X will output 20 volts peak to peak High-Z or 10 volts peak to peak @ 50 Ohms.  It just won't push much in the way of current, say at one Ohm.  If I have to output to something under 50 Ohms, then I need a pretty significant current boost which I've been able to do with an Op-Amp and MOSFET or just use the power Op-Amp I mentioned above.  Seems to work fine unless I need really fast rise and fall times, which to me we're now talking digital, not analog.

I don't really want to build a board, i'd rather purchase one of the many H-bridge boards out there but unsure if these boards will output a complex carrier wave and modulation accurately.

interesting

Quote from nav on June 22nd, 2018, 12:48 AM

I don't really want to build a board, i'd rather purchase one of the many H-bridge boards out there but unsure if these boards will output a complex carrier wave and modulation accurately.

If they do what I think they will do, you'll get on or off, nothing else.  You may be able to run that through a filter and simulate an analog signal, but I suspect with multiple frequencies present it will be highly distorted.

Years ago I purchased a 300 watt PA amplifier for audio range (20-20000 Hz) work.  It mostly did what I needed, but it has a transformer output which caused some problems when trying to connect it to another transformer (like the VIC, SFT, Ruslan grenade coil, etc).  I bought three 500 watt Class-D amplifiers from China which I blew out almost immediately--they can handle exactly four Ohms impedance and nothing else.  Ten seconds of power then pop, up in smoke.

Wish I could be more helpful Nav.  I think I know what you're looking for--kind of been down that road myself.  No standard solution.  If you can synthesize a digital signal that is exactly what you want, an H-Bridge power block will work, but if you need voltages in between on or off, then things are going to become quite a bit more difficult.

I guess one of the advantages of very fast h bridge is it can use h bridge logic and back switch electron extract

Just a Note petlov's works with h bridge so it is not a matter of working it is a matter of functions , timing of those functions and speed

Quote from Matt Watts on June 22nd, 2018, 07:16 AM

If they do what I think they will do, you'll get on or off, nothing else.  You may be able to run that through a filter and simulate an analog signal, but I suspect with multiple frequencies present it will be highly distorted.

Years ago I purchased a 300 watt PA amplifier for audio range (20-20000 Hz) work.  It mostly did what I needed, but it has a transformer output which caused some problems when trying to connect it to another transformer (like the VIC, SFT, Ruslan grenade coil, etc).  I bought three 500 watt Class-D amplifiers from China which I blew out almost immediately--they can handle exactly four Ohms impedance and nothing else.  Ten seconds of power then pop, up in smoke.

Wish I could be more helpful Nav.  I think I know what you're looking for--kind of been down that road myself.  No standard solution.  If you can synthesize a digital signal that is exactly what you want, an H-Bridge power block will work, but if you need voltages in between on or off, then things are going to become quite a bit more difficult.

I think you're correct. An Audio amp may be the only solution. I've looked at sub-woofer amps like these:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mini-HiFi-Stereo-Audio-Amplifier-Subwoofer-2Channel-for-Speaker-Car-PC-TV-Laptop/252861423404?epid=2130349506&hash=item3adfb71f2c:g:P6MAAOSw03lY7paX
Output is 4-16 ohms and my primary is 10 ohms. 500 watt output @ 5A. Should be ok for testing.

That could do the job Nav.  Do treat it real gingerly.  Some of the amps I smoked supposedly had overload protection; in my case the shutoff was permanent.  Watch the output on the scope so you can detect if it's clipping, that's the first sign of disaster.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 24th, 2018, 08:44 AM

That could do the job Nav.  Do treat it real gingerly.  Some of the amps I smoked supposedly had overload protection; in my case the shutoff was permanent.  Watch the output on the scope so you can detect if it's clipping, that's the first sign of disaster.

What voltages did you input from the signal gen? Audio amps only allow mV into their circuitry, if you're driving the line input with too much voltage then it will clip for sure. I could drive the above amp with the output from my sound card all day with any arbitrary wave form providing the line output doesn't exceed the amps input rms maximum. Once you start hitting them with voltages above 500mV rms then you'll run into trouble. Some cheap sound cards can hit 1.2v rms which would fry it right away, you can actually turn down the output on a PC's settings to make sure a PC doesn't overdrive an amp. In the case of my sig gen I can also keep that value low enough. These amps will output 40-50v rms with very little line voltage because of the 12vdc operational voltage they use. Ordering that one tomorrow so we'll see how much distortion they produce compared to the line input. Another thing about these little amps is the cooling. The fins and casing often don't produce enough venting and it is advisable to stick a 12v fan driven by the supply voltage to keep them cool. You have to treat these amps as if it were an optocoupler you were driving and not the base of a fet or BP transistor which can take more punishment.

Quote from nav on June 24th, 2018, 11:16 AM

What voltages did you input from the signal gen? Audio amps only allow mV into their circuitry,

Line level, 1 volt max.

Quote from nav on June 24th, 2018, 11:16 AM

Ordering that one tomorrow so we'll see how much distortion they produce compared to the line input.

I have my fingers crossed this will help your research a great deal.  Being able to push some analog signals into your coils will allow you to see things you just can't see with digital drivers.

Got to position 16.25

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6BnCUBKgnnc&feature=youtu.be&t=16m25s



Got to position 16.25

That is correct Dan.  However, keep in mind something that was unavailable to Mr. Dollard at that point in time...

We have digital switching devices today that are so fast they can deliver impulse waves unobtainable by purely analog components.  These impulses were found by Mr. Tesla to be highly advantageous.  In Mr. Tesla's day, he was forced to use magnetically quenched spark gaps; today we have silicon carbide MOSFETs that will alter current flow in less than 5 nanoseconds at thousands of volts potential.  If Mr. Tesla would have had the components available today, I can only imagine what kind of systems he could have invented.

The beauty of working completely analog is that one can see the electrical trends.  You can see where you are and calculate where you need to be to obtain the effect you are after.  In Nav's case, he can mix and modulate signals as per Puharich's specifications and determine if water actually has specific frequencies in the audio band.  It was always my feeling you needed frequencies in the gigahertz range to effectively disassociate water.  What Nav may be able to find out is if it's possible to start with a low audio frequency and have the harmonics produce the same effect.  That in itself would be a huge achievement.  I truly hope he is successful.

I think we have to remember we are tuning the circuit not the water ,  what I mean is lc circuit

Acid Byte from tesla forums post this very cool h bridge


God Speed Switching

Speed Noted I think about 200khz at tops. (Switches are igbts)

How fast can we make this ??

whats is the fastest we can make boys and girls ? any takers to design such and post

The faster we pulse gate and extract the better

DD

The  first meyers h Bridge above in this thread  only ran at 50khz
This one does that times 4.
Also the current on this one is much much higher and can peak out at 120amps for sure

This is Thanks to Acid Bytes work on this he is doing similar with tesla stuff

Note
for even faster switching (but less current) you can change out the switches with mosfets.
The it can handle 500khz maybe even more

Great !!!

Geez Dan, you didn't see this post I guess:
http://open-source-energy.org/?topic=1851.msg48891#msg48891

Put some silicon carbide MOSFETs on there and run it 'til it bleeds.  :-)

Yes, I bought one and it's about as good as you'll get.

Myself, I don't care for a half bridge.  Much prefer a Universal Switch--closest thing to an actual mechanical switch that can run at a much higher speed.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 29th, 2018, 01:28 AM

Geez Dan, you didn't see this post I guess:
http://open-source-energy.org/?topic=1851.msg48891#msg48891

Put some silicon carbide MOSFETs on there and run it 'til it bleeds.  :-)

Yes, I bought one and it's about as good as you'll get.

Myself, I don't care for a half bridge.  Much prefer a Universal Switch--closest thing to an actual mechanical switch that can run at a much higher speed.

Did you see the very last control box Stan designed on the estate pictures? The SCR which was controlled by a optocoupler in previous designs was replaced with a solid state relay. Stan did many designs to cover every angle of his patents but only actually used a couple of his designs. The one's that I know he had working for sure had this in common:-
1. On his 9 cell alternator design, he has two signals, one from the alternator and one from a variac. One signal is modulating the other then he gates it.
2. On his buggy set up he modulates the alternator signal with a 50% duty cycle pulse then gates it again.
Same pattern in both designs.
In Puharich's set up, he modulates a carrier wave BUT he uses a TAU of 3 seconds to vary the entire signal voltage from zero to 100% voltage then back to zero. Three distinct similarities but the TAU and gate differ in the fact that the gate does not offer a ranging voltage amplitude.
What conclusions can we take from this?
The conclusions are staring us in the face, the spin state of water to which Puharich refers which is affected by the length of TAU does not require zero to 100% voltage amplitude across TAU, it only requires that you DEFINE the length of TAU. In other words the spin state of water is not responding to TAU voltage amplitude but responding to TIME differential.
Look at Stan's schematic, he places a T3 in his gate.

Therefore is must be concluded that Stan's Meyers entire signal length including each pulse train and the following gate of zero voltage is three seconds. It then replicates Puharich's TAU perfectly because it starts at zero voltage and ends in zero voltage, anything between is irrelevant. You can have 2.5 seconds of pulses and half a second of gate, you can have 1.7 seconds of pulse and 1.3 seconds of gate etc etc etc. As long as it is 3 seconds exactly between the start of each positive pulse train and the voltage starts and ends at zero then you are at correct TAU. Are people not seeing this?

There is absolutely no doubt about it, Stan Meyer's gate and Puharich's TAU is the exact same thing. All you need to do to make Stan's designs work is to set the gate as follows:- The duty cycle of the gate needs to be at 90% in favour of  'on' and 10% in favour of 'off'. BUT...the entire length of the gate time on and off must be three seconds exact. This is the error of our ways.

Great Guys excellent Nav and Matt we still learn about stan every day it amazes me how much he did in such short time God was on his should hold the  light I thing he must have works 24 hrs and than some it is hard to comprehend we all have worked on thsi  many years teams  of people and some how we still discover things it is crazy

 

We know we can use the
H bridge as Gate  but can we back switch the electron extract this is important to achieve now
we are on this topic.
=========================================
NOTES
a)
Max had  Optos on the 9xa

b)
Mike Made 9xa opto mosfets as gate and also mosfets in a totem pole arrangemen to drive 2n3055 or IRFP260N etc t  https://youtu.be/cmMURk12akg

c)
Valentin Petkov /valyonpz/ uses totem pole and show solid relay using in some cases as gate
(remember inverter on signal)  https://youtu.be/namRpMcrd84
========================================
My Invitation and comment is

Can we confirm
the H bridge can be the Gate and the electron extract ( using h bridge forward reverse logic)?

What Timing controls can be on it ? Gate vs pulses to keep ratio but accelerate repetitions
=======================================================================
NAV NOTES
set the gate as follows:-
The duty cycle of the gate needs to be at 90% in favor of  'on' and 10% in favor of 'off'. BUT...the entire length of the gate time on and off must be three seconds exact. This is the error of our ways.

Can we keep ration but accelerate the repetitions to as fasts as possible?

=================
1 can advanced the boards above
we draw up a specific H bridge totem daughter board with ration adjust  or speed adjust of reptitions and post it here

So to control gate fast silicon mosfets (to Nav ration 90/10) and also switch back the electron extract to 9xd during gate off ? 
to make usable voltage.

The faster we do the gates and switch back to electron extract caps better the result if ratio keep ism y feeling

If we keep Ratio 90 on 10 off we can in fact increase speed and stay true to the forumla?
We know there are high performance results on to electrons and atoms ionization
with fast pulse and gate best is picosecond rates.

to use such we would jump specifically of 9xa/9xb and have inverted signal
so we can jump 9XA and use  like  Mike did above and have invert signal to stay tru to the meyers

All comments welcome as this is a great topic on locking
in a daughter board every one can trust and use

PS from Deep study of  pulsing red leds the best ionization rate at low wattage into water spiting = best results are in picosecond

do this driver could also be added to the 9xd and run leds in fast rate


Daniel




 

Been researching Puharich's work from 1970 onward and read some interesting patents from 1970 and 1971. It seems that the electrolysis work was discovered accidentally after Puharich was working on electrical impulse systems for removing blood clots in the heart of humans. he seems to have discovered the electrolysis phenomenon as a sideline of that research.See here on patent listings:
3,563,246 Feb., 1971 ~ Puharich 331/47. 
3,726,762 Apr., 1973  ~ Puharich 128/422. 
4,107,008 Aug., 1978  ~ Horvath 204/129. 
Puharich used audio equipment which he amplified into a VIC to perform the work but here is where I think Stan came into the equation: Stan was not particularly educated in the field of audio frequency carriers and modulations but was educated in the field of am RF carriers and modulations having been in the military and involved with their communications systems. For example, Puharich never refers to the cell as a resonant cavity which Stan does and this term is taken from microwave radar systems. Puharich calls the cell a thermodynamic device. See here: https://www.apparentlyapparel.com/uploads/5/3/5/6/5356442/the_gordian_knot_of_the_great_energy_bind_-_puharich.pdf
Rather than using audio, Stan took Puharich's research onto another level and removed the need for audio drivers and amplifiers, instead applying the work into variacs and car alternators as signal providers but one thing remains certain; Stan could not get around the water nuclear spin relaxation constant, tau =3.0 secs though and he knew it because this will not work without it. Puharich states in two separate patents that i've read that without tau @ 3.0 secs, though extensive research over years he concluded the phenomena ceases to exist. Because Stan isn't using audio drive circuits and cannot vary the voltage from zero to 100% and back to zero over 3 secs he has to apply tau in a different way. He starts off at zero voltage with his carrier, pulses that carrier though a gate for a number of pulses defined by his own modulation phase and ends at zero voltage after 3 seconds of modulated carrier frequency. Securesupplies, the gate off time might only need to be a millisecond, but as long as there is a defined zero voltage start and zero voltage end with a gap between pulses then that will define tau via a gate. This phenomena cannot and will not work unless you read exactly word for word what Puharich is saying. Petkov in his video's is so...so close to replicating the work but he's got the tau at the wrong frequency on his pulsing amps video using a solid state relay. He's got the wrong frequency and the wrong duty cycle.
The positive voltage pulse train should be as follows :-
0 to 1.3 volt pulsing amplitude modulation with .tau. at 3.0 seconds. You can use 5khz carrier or you can use 4khz carrier, either way you'll end up with 3.980khz carrier and four resonant harmonic signals each pulsing 0-1.3v rms.