Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #25, on April 9th, 2017, 10:37 AM »
GPS, I was only inputting 12v into the primary which i've reduced in size to 4 ohms which seems to have brought the VIC to life. Now imagine if I input 200v into the primary? I hate to think what the voltages are going to be across the spark gap and the output of the chokes but lets take this one step at a time. Today I learned something more.

gpssonar

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #26, on April 9th, 2017, 10:44 AM »
Keep up the great work, everyone is heading in the right direction. Just be careful and not let all that stray stuff floating around make you sick. It will have an effect on your body if around it to long at a time.

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #27, on April 9th, 2017, 11:11 AM »
Quote from gpssonar on April 9th, 2017, 10:44 AM
Keep up the great work, everyone is heading in the right direction. Just be careful and not let all that stray stuff floating around make you sick. It will have an effect on your body if around it to long at a time.
Yeah, we are learning all the time, no more exploding secondaries and diodes hopefully. Was gonna pack it all in last week, now its a different ball game, got some better cores coming on tuesday, more efficient ones. Anyone wanting to know how I wired my bifilar chokes, it was like this:

Matt Watts

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #28, on April 9th, 2017, 04:18 PM »Last edited on April 9th, 2017, 04:27 PM
Quote from gpssonar on April 9th, 2017, 10:44 AM
Just be careful and not let all that stray stuff floating around make you sick. It will have an effect on your body if around it to long at a time.
Damn straight Ronnie!

I met the guys that use this stuff for weapons and it's rather...   something.

You don't need crazy sparks for this to work.  Tiny little pops are actually better.  You pour the coal to this and happen to hit a wavelength that matches something biological in your body and it's game over.



So where do we go from here nav...?

Well, we are dealing with nodes of purely dielectric potential.  We need a way to see them nodes and their spacing.  My thought is using neon bulbs.  As you are aware now, you only need one wire as Nelson Rocha has demonstrated multiple times.  What I propose is to connect your system to a cell, but use bare solid copper wire, fairly straight.  The cell at this point doesn't matter too much, we just need something out on the end to close the loop.  Along that length of bare copper wire we need to apply a neon and move it around looking for spots of high and low intensity, those I will presume to be the nodes.  If you can find them, then we need to figure out how to adjust their spacing.  I'm guessing the chokes is the place to start, probably just one of them (L2) initially.  If by taking turns off of this choke, the node spacing changes or the nodes move around, bingo, we are hot on the trail and a working system is just around the corner.  My gut says when those nodes align with the plates on the cell, you should be splitting water.


Gunther Rattay

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #29, on April 9th, 2017, 11:15 PM »Last edited on April 9th, 2017, 11:20 PM
Quote from nav on April 9th, 2017, 09:32 AM
Matt this phenomenon only occurs with the bifilar chokes configured in a certain manner. If I disconnect the secondary from the chokes there is no spark and it doesn't work. I was quite exited with the result as you will see from the video. Houston, this is tranquality base, the Eagle has landed.
There is some kind of radiant energy in the room, even with both multimeter probes disconnected it still produces high voltages somewhere all over the room. It's scary Poo with all this electrostatic voltage floating around the room. Do think I should go for a one wire light bulb in the next experiment?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WgVmsHyf84
nav, that really looks promising!
what makes me trouble is that i know that spark gaps always produce serious interference to electronic devices. so the mulitimeter open loop nearby the spark gap is the weak point of your measurement configuration.

to verify voltage potential built up i would suggest to make an electrometer measurement to exclude any electronic interference. preferebly it should be a mechanical device with no electronics as shown here
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrometer



of course it´s difficult to find such a device today and a scope measurement with high voltage probe should be a good alternative. if there is interference to the electronics as one of alex petty´s vids showed it won´t directly interfere voltage amplitude but create display issues instead looking like visual jitter all over the display.

Diadon

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #30, on April 10th, 2017, 01:52 AM »
     It was a quick and dirty setup for the night. Just seeing how low of a power setup I could do with a ZVS and Flyback Transformer with the hairpin setup.  3 Watts of power does not seem correct for how hot the Anode of the SG was getting. I am too tired to start doing calculations right now but I will get back to this. When put in water with a mild NaOH electrolyte, no Hydrogen on the Cathode, but plenty of oxygen on the Anode. This is only half wave rectified so I will add a FWBR soon and do some more crude experiments to see if its worth finalizing for the LENR experiments.

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #31, on April 10th, 2017, 10:50 AM »
Today I tested the system with a dead short across the choke outputs in the first video then in the second video in keeping with tradition we have the one wire light bulb. Remember we are only inputting 12v into the primary at this stage until it is considered safe to up the voltage to the systems full output of 200v into the VIC primary.
You can see why stan used the gate because you can use it to tune the system.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9nvhZWxqBQ&feature=youtu.be


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iy_U7VOvU80&feature=youtu.be
Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #32, on April 10th, 2017, 11:57 AM »
There are indeed health concerns with this equipment, today the system turned the tv off in another room, Lord knows what kind of spurious emmissions its throwing out and as for turning the voltage up in the primary, that will be dodgy to say the least. Definately RF mixed in there somewhere besides the Electrostatic voltages.
Current+voltage+oscillator = RF and even though the current is minimal there is still RF. There is no wonder Stan had VIC in an Aluminium case to block the spurious emmissions. Gonna have to build something similar myself.
Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #33, on April 10th, 2017, 03:31 PM »
And moving swiftly on.........Setting the spark gap to get maximum voltage across the capacitor (WFC). No spark then there is no voltage, it's as simple as that.
Matt, i'm thinking we need to take the diode from between the secondary and L1 and place it between L1 and the cell. What do you think?
That way the cell will step charge instead of being caught up in a tank circuit that the spark gap is causing between the secondary and the chokes. Just a thought.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeQWXaJdB88&feature=youtu.be

Matt Watts

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #34, on April 10th, 2017, 05:40 PM »
You are kicking it Nav!   Good info on the gating, makes a lot more sense now what gating adds to the equation.

Now, you witnessed voltage across a cell, that's something very few people have done.  Big plus there.


Here's the tough part...

You need to think of dielectricity propagating as pressure waves like sound--high potential and low potential moving in between the wires to the cell.

What we want is standing waves--they don't appear to be moving.  A high potential wave will sit on the B+ plate and a low potential wave will sit stationary on the B- plate.  When you get that, I'm pretty sure it's show time as long as the difference between the high and low is enough to get the water splitting and keep it there.  Ronnie mentioned that we may need just a bit of current flow to get the process started and I'm not fully sure where this will come from.  Current is magnetism and there isn't any magnetism in these dielectric waves.

Also, many people may have not seen this device Stan built; it's in the estate photos though and if you are understanding what I am saying, you'll know immediately why Stan needed this device.

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #35, on April 11th, 2017, 09:22 AM »
There is just one thing that worries me Matt, the spark gap is parallel to both the chokes and the WFC and although I'm pleased to see 1000v plus across the WFC, the fact still remains I can get over 2000v open circuit from the chokes in this circuit. I would like to see the spark gap in series with the cell perhaps between the positive output of the secondary and the negative pole of the negative choke or perhaps in the bifilar circuitry of the chokes themselves.
The reason I think this is because I think we need to encourage series capacitance in relation to the spark gap instead of parallel capacitance.
Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #36, on April 11th, 2017, 09:28 AM »
You see Parallel spark gaps and the related capacitance doesn't force B+ voltage in the cell but instead causes B+ as a kind of side kick. We need the voltage on B+ to be a direct series effect of the high impedance spark gap. That way the spark gap cannot work without the water fuel cell and vice versa.

Lynx

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #38, on April 11th, 2017, 09:41 PM »
So the spark gap is directly parallel to the WFC, right?
All spark across the spark gap but no voltage in the WFC, is that what I'm seeing?

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #39, on April 12th, 2017, 09:42 AM »Last edited on April 12th, 2017, 09:47 AM
Quote from Lynx on April 11th, 2017, 09:41 PM
So the spark gap is directly parallel to the WFC, right?
All spark across the spark gap but no voltage in the WFC, is that what I'm seeing?
The hairpin circuit is not Stan's series tuned circuit unless of course Stan was using an hidden spark gap. This week using Matt's idea of a spark gap across the secondary we have established through testing that you can have a dead short across the choke outputs and still produce dielectricity which you can read on a meter. We have established that the dielectricity exists in 'nodes' in  similar fashion to where voltage maxima exists on an antenna and there are standing waves of the voltage maxima in the circuit.
We have established that you can get a 1000v across the cell and use the frequency and spark gap width to increase or decrease the capacitance across the WFC. This happens while keeping current at a minimum and you must have air gaps in the core or it will not work.
All of this is without the chokes operating at their self resonant frequency and not operating at their highest voltage amplitude. It shows people what happens when you use a spark gap as a matching device so that the stored voltage of the secondary and two chokes begin to form a resonant relationship that is not entirely dependent on the primary drive frequency.
Also discovered this week is the fact that the primary can overheat the core. Last night I had the system on for about an hour and because my primary is only 4 ohms it overheated the laminated core which is now unusable. The primary needs to be higher impedance but then you lose voltage on the secondary because of the turns ratio.
Another important fact is upping the voltage into the primary of the VIC. You cannot use another transformer between the output of the TIP3055 and the primary of the VIC. The reason being, too many core losses in the step up, too much voltage and current exchanges in the core and most importantly the frequency such a transformer runs at does not match the frequency at which you can get the spark gap to induce a 1000v across the cell.
So using a TV flyback transformer between the 12v output of the TIP3055 and the primary does not work. I tested this and I'll make a short video tonight about this. But basically what happens is the flyback takes 2 amps to run at its most efficient frequency and produces 20kv, when you input the high voltage into the VIC primary there isn't enough current to create flux and what happens is the normal voltage to current exchange which we see in all transformers when we connect step up transformers onto more step up transformers, you end up with less voltage than the TIP3055 originally outputted and the rest is absorbed into core losses.
To make the VIC work we must rectify mains voltage usually via a Variac as the power source and then a full bridge rectifier into the TIP3055 without any smoothing caps which is what Stan does. Then you have a variable high current high voltage supply into the VIC which when you increase the voltage also has enough available current to compensate for core losses so the voltage amplitude will not suffer. This is what I intend to do eventually but at the minute i'm only using low voltage so we can measure the system better.
We have also established this week that the VIC is dirty, throwing out spurious emmissions all over my house, turning TV's on and off in other room's, lighting light bulbs with only one wire and sending multimeters barmy with electrostatic voltages floating around the room which is quite dangerous as Ronnie correctly pointed out, bad for your health and bad for electronic appliances that can overload from the voltage such as cell phones etc.
The spurious emmissions are bad enough with 12v into the VIC primary so imagine what 50 or 100 volts will do, remember there is RF mixed in with these waves too which is not healthy.
When I update my equipment and build a more accurate core i'm going to show what happens on the scope, drive the whole system with a better pulse generator and have some kind of variac into the TIP3055.
I think through the video's i've done on this thread and with a bit of help from Matt, have shown what can be done when the chokes are not operating at self resonance but the real money shot comes when we start pinging the chokes at their self resonant frequency where voltage amplitude is the highest, then see what the spark gap does.


Lynx

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #40, on April 12th, 2017, 10:09 AM »
Most interesting, thanks Nav :thumbsup:

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #41, on April 12th, 2017, 10:21 AM »
Quote from Lynx on April 12th, 2017, 10:09 AM
Most interesting, thanks Nav :thumbsup:
You're welcome. Did you see the video using the spark gap to tune the WFC voltage Lynx? I managed to achieve over a 1000v onto the cell in a none resonant condition. There is enough information in this thread to push people onto more success and I hope folks have learned something from it. I've been electrocuted three times this week, once with a tv flyback transformer kicking out over 10kv, my pain and your gain lol. But at least no burned out componants.

Matt Watts

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #42, on April 12th, 2017, 10:34 AM »
Quote from nav on April 12th, 2017, 10:21 AM
I managed to achieve over a 1000v onto the cell in a none resonant condition.
"  IMPORTANT !  "     as Dustin mentioned in one of his videos.

The reason being, the WFC no longer appears as a dead short.  And if you do connect a truly dead short with a copper pipe or similar, the LMD waves prefer the path of higher resistance, so they will still traverse the WFC instead of the copper pipe.  This has to be because dielectricity sees conductors as reflectors (as Mr. Dollard has stated).

The second plus in what Nav has accomplished is showing how spurious non-resonant impulses still achieve the same end result.  With that knowledge, if the conditions are met to where the WFC actually begins to charge up, imagine what will occur when a sustained and tuned stream of these waves enter the WFC.  It should charge rapidly to peak voltages that exceed what Nav is able to measure.  That's when he will be able to hold a fluorescent tube in one hand and just wave it around his WFC causing it to glow.  If at this point he isn't creating gas bubbles, I'll be extremely surprised.

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #43, on April 12th, 2017, 02:38 PM »
Quote from Matt Watts on April 12th, 2017, 10:34 AM
"  IMPORTANT !  "     as Dustin mentioned in one of his videos.

The reason being, the WFC no longer appears as a dead short.  And if you do connect a truly dead short with a copper pipe or similar, the LMD waves prefer the path of higher resistance, so they will still traverse the WFC instead of the copper pipe.  This has to be because dielectricity sees conductors as reflectors (as Mr. Dollard has stated).

The second plus in what Nav has accomplished is showing how spurious non-resonant impulses still achieve the same end result.  With that knowledge, if the conditions are met to where the WFC actually begins to charge up, imagine what will occur when a sustained and tuned stream of these waves enter the WFC.  It should charge rapidly to peak voltages that exceed what Nav is able to measure.  That's when he will be able to hold a fluorescent tube in one hand and just wave it around his WFC causing it to glow.  If at this point he isn't creating gas bubbles, I'll be extremely surprised.
Interesting Matt. Also to consider is the fact that the chokes are not running at resonance where the voltage amplitude is the greatest and neither is the secondary. We know through cold cathode systems that the greatest voltage amplitude to the tube is acheived when the inductor is resonant at the oscillator frequency. If we use that knowledge together with the knowledge we know about hairpin circuits we can coerce voltage onto the WFC with a spark gap and inductors that are resonant at the oscillator frequency.
Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #44, on April 12th, 2017, 03:35 PM »
Quote from Matt Watts on April 12th, 2017, 10:34 AM
"  IMPORTANT !  "     as Dustin mentioned in one of his videos.

The reason being, the WFC no longer appears as a dead short.  And if you do connect a truly dead short with a copper pipe or similar, the LMD waves prefer the path of higher resistance, so they will still traverse the WFC instead of the copper pipe.  This has to be because dielectricity sees conductors as reflectors (as Mr. Dollard has stated).

The second plus in what Nav has accomplished is showing how spurious non-resonant impulses still achieve the same end result.  With that knowledge, if the conditions are met to where the WFC actually begins to charge up, imagine what will occur when a sustained and tuned stream of these waves enter the WFC.  It should charge rapidly to peak voltages that exceed what Nav is able to measure.  That's when he will be able to hold a fluorescent tube in one hand and just wave it around his WFC causing it to glow.  If at this point he isn't creating gas bubbles, I'll be extremely surprised.
Matt, I see it a slightly different way but it adds to the same result. Different conductors and their respective electrical lengths present different impedances to the hairpin circuit not because they are reflective but because transmission lines carry nodes of high impedance that often present an open circuit. All antennae carry an inductive element and a capacitive element which are closely related and effect the resonance of the antenna, we can tune antennae with the capacitive element or the inductive element or both together.
So imagine the hairpin is a closed loop antenna with a dead short across the top and in the case of a Tesla hairpin you have two capacitors an inductor, a spark gap and a drive frequency. We can control the impedance of the dead short with its electrical length, the capacitive element and the inductive element, we can make it appear open circuit, closed circuit or somewhere in between the two which is partially conductive. But here is the money shot, we can make the system conductive at one particular frequency but none conductive at another frequency OR we can use a capacitor/inductor combinations placed strategically in the system which can cause different electrical lengths of wire to present different parallel impedances.
The top of the hairpin circuit (dead short) therefore is cut to a resonant length which presents an high impedance to the oscillator (high resistance), thats why its adjustable. The parallel circuits below the dead short present a lower impedance to the oscillator and lower impedance means less resistance.
Then you ask yourself what is the spark gap doing in the hairpin circuit? The inductor in the hairpin forms or trys to form a tank circuit with the capacitors but it can't because of the high resistance, high impedance dead short across the top of the hairpin, the spark gap shunts out the high resistance circuit in the same way a dc shunt, shunts out the 1000ohms of a half wave shunt fed antenna to 50 ohms.


Current and voltage will not pass high impedance nodes in transmission lines

Matt Watts

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #45, on April 12th, 2017, 06:23 PM »Last edited on April 12th, 2017, 09:36 PM
I won't disagree with you there nav.  What you are saying works perfectly with classical engineering.

What I'm saying or you're saying may not actually match with the true reality of nature, but it's the tools we have at the moment to try and figure nature out and get her to do what we seek.  It's just a perspective, a description we use in our minds to comprehend what is going on.  My point is not to get stuck on terminology.  None of us even know with absolute certainty what electricity is.  Tesla didn't know either, but he found ways to get it to work for him.

Funny, I just read this post from our old buddy Ed.  He can get 9400 volts across his cell now, but still no magic.  Why do you suppose that is?

I'll tell you why.  He doesn't have a method to see where the standing wave nodes are.  He even states they don't seem important.  In other words, he doesn't know what is really going on with his VIC.  If he did and got standing nodes aligned with his exciter array, he'd realize it isn't necessary to pour so much coal to his VIC.  Voltage by itself means nothing.  Getting the dielectric charge density nodes properly placed on the exciter array and keeping them there is everything.  My instincts tell me this is the whole trick to this device.  We need to think like Stan in the beginning--what do we want and how do we accomplish it.  I think I see now what we need; getting there is going to be a bit tricky.  Why?  Because it's easy to fall back on classical thinking.  I'm afraid if we do that, we're toast.  Classical thinking has no mechanism to account for LMD waves or even dielectricity for that matter.

My thought for today is:   With all the great many works produced by modern engineers of today, do you suppose just for a moment, maybe they built all this stuff, yet really don't thoroughly know how it works?  Can they tell you with absolute certainty what electricity is, what it's composed of, the many forms it can exist as?   No they cannot, but they can manipulate it well enough so your smart phone rings most of the time when you're called.

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #46, on April 13th, 2017, 02:10 AM »
Quote from Matt Watts on April 12th, 2017, 06:23 PM
I won't disagree with you there nav.  What you are saying works perfectly with classical engineering.

What I'm saying or you're saying may not actually match with the true reality of nature, but it's the tools we have at the moment to try and figure nature out and get her to do what we seek.  It's just a perspective, a description we use in our minds to comprehend what is going on.  My point is not to get stuck on terminology.  None of us even know with absolute certainty what electricity is.  Tesla didn't know either, but he found ways to get it to work for him.

Funny, I just read this post from our old buddy Ed.  He can get 9400 volts across his cell now, but still no magic.  Why do you suppose that is?

I'll tell you why.  He doesn't have a method to see where the standing wave nodes are.  He even states they don't seem important.  In other words, he doesn't know what is really going on with his VIC.  If he did and got standing nodes aligned with his exciter array, he'd realize it isn't necessary to pour so much coal to his VIC.  Voltage by itself means nothing.  Getting the dielectric charge density nodes properly placed on the exciter array and keeping them there is everything.  My instincts tell me this is the whole trick to this device.  We need to think like Stan in the beginning--what do we want and how do we accomplish it.  I think I see now what we need; getting there is going to be a bit tricky.  Why?  Because it's easy to fall back on classical thinking.  I'm afraid if we do that, we're toast.  Classical thinking has no mechanism to account for LMD waves or even dielectricity for that matter.

My thought for today is:   With all the great many works produced by modern engineers of today, do you suppose just for a moment, maybe they built all this stuff, yet really don't thoroughly know how it works?  Can they tell you with absolute certainty what electricity is, what it's composed of, the many forms it can exist as?   No they cannot, but they can manipulate it well enough so your smart phone rings most of the time when you're called.
In my mind having read what you've said recently, the way to do it is to create an high density node for the dielectricity to conveniantly slip into which in my mind would be something like this: There are six nodes on the hairpin, 1.Current maxima, 2 Current minima, 3 Voltage maxima, 4 Voltage minima, 5 Inpedance maxima, 6 Impedance minima. I think we need the Voltage maxima node to appear exactly in the impedance minima node. Which is, incidentally the first parallel adjoinment after the spark gap while still having a resonant high impedance dead short in place. But we also need to ping the chokes at their self resonant frequency so that voltage amplitude peaks on the WFC.

securesupplies

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #47, on April 13th, 2017, 02:21 AM »
Quote from ~Russ on April 6th, 2017, 09:12 AM
we are lucky enough to have the original videos from the lectures that Alex was talkign about:
i created a play list:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLsiIKXpZfLKIrGFmX3bQa5LR55dM0R0mb
IN VIDEO 9  POSITION  4.35   
can any one find the patent reference or name of patents he mentions of the  diode loop?Karl Palsness   DIODE PLUG


===============================
Quote from ~Russ on April 6th, 2017, 09:12 AM
enjoy

~Russ

nav

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #48, on April 13th, 2017, 02:37 AM »
So the hairpin acts as a looped shortened transmission line (via the inductor) and is resonant at the oscillator frequency which creates a standard high impedance node at the farest point. Then somewhere between the high impedance node and the spark gap is a high density voltage zone with a lower impedance and if you sit the water fuel cell across it then you'll get high voltage trying to take a lower impedance route.
Matt, you've actually worked it out I do believe.

Lynx

Re: Non Linear Power Transmission With Tesla Hairpin Circuit (Alex Petty)
« Reply #49, on April 13th, 2017, 08:07 AM »
Keep it coming :thumbsup2: