Diesel/Air flame temperature 1200*C

HHO flame temperature 2800*C

Will piston or turbine generator receiving one kilogram HHO produce 56KW ?

56KW electricity produces one kilogram of HHO.

Quote from DaS Energy on December 6th, 2012, 11:32 PM

Diesel/Air flame temperature 1200*C

HHO flame temperature 2800*C

Will piston or turbine generator receiving one kilogram HHO produce 56KW ?

56KW electricity produces one kilogram of HHO.

Probably needs to be qualified.  Anyone that has an HHO torch will tell you that the ambient flame temperature is rather cool, but when brought against something like tungsten, gets extremely hot.  What temperature HHO gets to inside an ICE would indeed be difficult to measure.

For the power conversion of HHO, the Faraday constant is 140 Watts per Liter per Minute.  Plate power density must be kept lower than 0.54 amps per square inch across the plates to prevent thermal runaway.

The reverse conversion is far more difficult because it all depends on the efficiency of the engine or turbine.  Factors such as humidity content, ignition method, et cetra, must all be taken into account and as far as I can tell, need to be calculated/measured experimentally.  With techniques currently available, it does seem quite likely that generating HHO from water requires slightly less energy than converting HHO back to water if done properly.  In this cycle, it would appear there is an opportunity to harness excess free energy.

Thank You,

I fully out of my league with HHO,

Flame temperature provides expansion heat giving the drive forces to ICE. Wondered if enough wattage back out of the generator to suopply HH0 to ICE.

Cheers Peter

Quote from DaS Energy on December 7th, 2012, 07:41 AM

Thank You,

I fully out of my league with HHO,

Flame temperature provides expansion heat giving the drive forces to ICE. Wondered if enough wattage back out of the generator to suopply HH0 to ICE.

Cheers Peter

I think so.  The trick I believe is adding water mist and plasma jet ignition.  I'm in the process of gathering a 60 plate HHO dry cell and CDI module that I can modify to produce a plasma spark.  A piezoelectric transducer can be had to generate the water mist.  I already have the ICE/generator to use and a variac for throttle control--determines HHO production rate.

The ICE modification includes removing the carburetor and adding the CDI where timing can be delayed to well after TDC since HHO and plasma spark initiates combustion so much faster than a conventional spark with gasoline.  Then to get a plasma spark, you add a high voltage diode between the spark plug and the output of the CDI.  What happens is the spark essentially closes the gap of the spark plug like a short circuit, then the massive current still available in the CDI's output capacitor takes the path of least resistance through the diode and dumps the high current at the spark gap creating a powerful plasma ball.  This plasma spark is so powerful that it will actually split and ignite some of the water mist which is added in with the HHO to the intake port.  It's this later part where I think most of the efficiency gains can be had.

I have yet to test all this and give hard numbers, but I am working on it and do believe at the very minimum I can close-loop this system.  How much excess energy I can harvest off I do not know, hopefully several hundred watts.  I suspect further work will be needed to make it reliable, practical, sustainable and scalable.  I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

If you need some incentive, here is a video of what others are doing:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMlciNOyo_U
Notice there is:

• No Carburator

• HHO Cell

• External ignition coil

• Variac

• Adjusted timing mechanism

• Additional shop light

[/list]

I tend to think it is the real deal and should be something that can be replicated.

I take my hat off to you , good luck with all.

Dont know if it of any help, but read 63KW makes 1 Kilogram HHO

Cheers Peter:)

Quote from DaS Energy on December 7th, 2012, 08:52 AM

I take my hat off to you , good luck with all.

Dont know if it of any help, but read 63KW makes 1 Kilogram HHO

Cheers Peter:)

And with your 50th post, I take mine off to you as well.

I'll look at that conversion in detail at some point because I can't quite see where it comes from without doing a bunch of unit conversions between volume, weight and power.

Man after ny own heart !

One reference of three I took.

http://zebu.uoregon.edu/disted/ph162/l14.html

I never like to complain about what we have without a solution , If we would go to thorium insted of uranium as the power for our nuclear power plants it is 100 times safer and 1/100 as much nuclear waste . Doesn't need a hi pressure enclosure , Was developed for a nuclear airplane by oak ridge labs. in the late 60's for the usaf. Cost about 1/10th as much to built and needs very littie land compared to a uranium plant. It appears to me the problem has to due with greed, not technology. Every medium sized town up could have it's own power plant.The greed comes in in both the profit of building the plant and charging for the power to your home. Lets develop over unity and stop this greed . May Papp power or heske power  richard clem power . please add to this list Ed hemphill

Hello edxhemphill,

Though I tottaly agree with your sentiments  That you quote uses the rock ape technology of boiling water. Far better instead to use sealed in recycling hot-cold Carbon Dioxide.
The heat need of it to acheive base load power generation is -10* Celsius. past that the power generation that is acheived at the point of boiling water is over 100 times that of Steam at the extreme temperature of 550* Celsius.

As you say its greed, but possibly first look to Coal and your Government desperate needs it be burnt to put money in its coffers.

I would bet my own life there is plenty of excellent technology out there locked away in a vault, that would totally change the world if it were ever to get loose.  It won't.  That's why we will have to rediscover it and make darn sure everyone gets to see it, build it, play with it and use it.  It is not going to be a walk in the park and cannot be done by a single person.  We think about it as a group; we each make our attempt to build it and we talk some more, until we get it.  THEN, we make sure everyone gets it, as quickly as possible before it magically gets shut down.  It's the only way.  We cannot let something we create get buried or locked away any more.  It's coming to a point where we need to do this for our very survival on this planet.  I hope anyone reading this understands how serious I am.  This is for all the marbles this time.  It can still fun, but in the back of your mind, listen to the little voice that says, "please, never give up."

Quote from Dog-One on February 19th, 2013, 10:39 PM

It can still fun, but in the back of your mind, listen to the little voice that says, "please, never give up."

“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”
― Henry Ford

Uch, we worrying warriors for new time.

Quote from FaradayEZ on February 25th, 2013, 11:15 PM

Uch, we worrying warriors for new time.

Oh yes you are EZ.  We need to get you in the shop with some parts.  Nothing like some good burns, cut fingers, scrapes and bruises to humble a guy.

Hello Dog-One,

Something that may interest you. However unlike all other posts this one does require a machiine shop.

Sorry, still havent quite got the hang of this.

Apinf Einstein physiics, fridge. 4 litres cycling a second commences preheat -10*C freezer, then -2*C fridge then +20* room temperature. Output 10KW. Upsized or downsized in heat and or volume.

Amount of electricity to produce hydrogen depends on the efficiency of the converter. If you're quoting Faraday you're already behind the 8-ball. He's dead, Jim.

There is 1234.44L of hydrogen available in a litre of water. A 56kW engine will probably need the equivalent of 3L/hr of diesel, or approx. 2.6L/hr of water, or approx. 3200L/hr of hydrogen. How you generate and/or store that, and how efficiently, is the problem to be addressed.