Dielectric Coating* inside Water Fuel Cell? because water is not dielectric property(it is a resistant property).
distill water can leak(flow of amps)if use high volts(example 220v).

like raviwfc's video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7E-QJf-xRQ
 
sorry about language
thanks
geenee

p.s. Eccles's patents explain about Meyer's tech water capacitor.And Eccles's capacitor has real dielectric property.

I`m not sure about the clothing. But at the estate photos is clearly visible some brown stuff on both wfc setups. On the old setup and on the new setup too. The derilin material is colored, and the stainless steel tubes too. Except one tube, which was taken out. Coincidence? I don`t know, but is something to think about it.

Quote from pakakezu on June 3rd, 2012, 01:35 PM

I`m not sure about the clothing. But at the estate photos is clearly visible some brown stuff on both wfc setups. On the old setup and on the new setup too. The derilin material is colored, and the stainless steel tubes too. Except one tube, which was taken out. Coincidence? I don`t know, but is something to think about it.

re this listen to stephen meyers video on youtube. he talks about
this alittle

there are 6 in the series not sure which one sorry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myPTsY4J2es

Quote from securesupplies on June 3rd, 2012, 01:50 PM

re this listen to stephen meyers video on youtube. he talks about
this alittle

It`s at the end of part 4. Somehow i missed until now.  Somehow i miss one more minute from the show, or something. Whenever gets exciting the show ends.

But back to our problem, i`m not sure what to say, but ravi`s results whit conditioned tubes are interesting, but the conditioning time is very long. I wanted to start a conditioning session years ago but i stopped. Anyway, that brown stuff appears after city water is used in any cell. Apparently is present on the exterior parts, and the inside surface remained clean. This confirms Stan`s statement about the impurity parts are remaining in the cell.

Quote from pakakezu on June 3rd, 2012, 01:35 PM

I`m not sure about the clothing. But at the estate photos is clearly visible some brown stuff on both wfc setups. On the old setup and on the new setup too. The derilin material is colored, and the stainless steel tubes too. Except one tube, which was taken out. Coincidence? I don`t know, but is something to think about it.

Just looking at it, it would appear like Rust/Iron and Minerals that are in the water. I've worked with submerged water pumps before and they would often get the same type of residue and built up like this. Even on Teflon pieces. With the tubes and the electrolysis of water I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was a natural side effect of it, exposing the impurities, calcium, minerals, turbidity, "Total Disolved Solids", (TDS)  and Iron in the water.

Quote from nbq201 on June 4th, 2012, 07:44 PM

Quote from pakakezu on June 3rd, 2012, 01:35 PM

I`m not sure about the clothing. But at the estate photos is clearly visible some brown stuff on both wfc setups. On the old setup and on the new setup too. The derilin material is colored, and the stainless steel tubes too. Except one tube, which was taken out. Coincidence? I don`t know, but is something to think about it.

Just looking at it, it would appear like Rust/Iron and Minerals that are in the water. I've worked with submerged water pumps before and they would often get the same type of residue and built up like this. Even on Teflon pieces. With the tubes and the electrolysis of water I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was a natural side effect of it, exposing the impurities, calcium, minerals, turbidity, "Total Disolved Solids", (TDS)  and Iron in the water.

Many people have wondered this same thing. Water is a dielectric liquid and is used in some high voltage capacitors. This water is prepared in a lab. With impurities, water is conductive. Water also self ionizes which can make it conductive. For use in capacitors, water has a very high dielectric value, around 80. Check out the book high voltage dielectric breakdown of water.

Now as far as Stan's equipment, a few people have asked Don Gable if there was a coating on the tubes. He said there was NO coating. (don is the man responsible for most of the pictures and measurements we have) The Vic is designed to restrict amp flow. If Stan had a coating on the electrodes restricting amp flow with the Vic would not be necessary. I have seen 1000 volts across my cell using inductors collapsing fields to restrict amp flow.

Just my 2 cents
Ravi and Lawton claim their success is directly related to a dielectric coating. No one has been able to validate their work.    

This is how ravi did the coating. its an excert from his replication document. page 14

If you order large pipes and cut them, you need to get the tubes annealed once they
are cut and finished to lengths before being assembled. It’s done in a separate inert
atmosphere furnace of Nitrogen or Argon. You have people who do heat treatment for
metals they'll give you the procedure if you tell them the grade you are using.
Tell them that you need a bright anneal in nitrogen or argon atmosphere. Annealing is
done after every cold work operation and at the finishing stage to reset the lattice
structure. As we are cutting the pipes and slightly finishing the surfaces with sand paper
to remove any imbedded impurities during tube drawing, it’s all cold working. So you
need to relieve these induces stresses in the lattice through annealing.
Ravi advises - Use an abrasive cutter or a saw and then anneal them as you induce a
lot of stresses in the lattice during cutting due to the hot and cold areas. If you use laser
then you could cut the annealed tubes as you are not inducing any mechanical
stresses during the cutting but you could check along the length with a compass and
see if there’s any difference. Take a compass close to the tubes and you can usually
see it deflecting before annealing but once the annealing is done the deflection is a
fraction of what you have seen before on the same tubes or none at all, this is what you
want.
Assembly options- It appears that Dave Lawton used insulated copper wire to connect
to his tubes. Ravi used spot wielded stainless steal wire on his tubes. Originally Ravi had
his wires too long which had a negative impact on his efficiency. He then had to
shorten them.

EPP = NO COATING

BUT RESONANT-CAVITY in injector system has DIAMOND COATING?(i saw from another webside)

i have a question.

IF EPP HAS MAGA GAS OUTPUT.WHY dont develop EPP FOR RUN A CAR. 200 LPM is enough?or EPP is not high gas out put?

 

Quote from geenee on June 9th, 2012, 02:44 PM

EPP = NO COATING

BUT RESONANT-CAVITY in injector system has DIAMOND COATING?(i saw from another webside)

i have a question.

IF EPP HAS MAGA GAS OUTPUT.WHY dont develop EPP FOR RUN A CAR. 200 LPM is enough?or EPP is not high gas out put?

How much power is required to produce that much gas?

i don't know that.i just thought.Stan say "restrict amps flow" if that real then Low power consume(same as you charge normal capacitor use a little amps when it full then stop amps flow).but problem when use natural water is amps flow.Same as real capacitor if leakage capacitor can't store electrostatic field then voltage can't rise nearly to input Voltage(when charge capacitor).

all this why no one has success.

if use natural water.the exciter plates need dielectric coating.
if use distilled water.no need dielectric coating.

i attached picture of dielectric strength values from wiki.i think distilled water is best dielectric property because low cost and high dielectric strength.Distilled water greater dielectric than air.THIS WHY Stan developed stream resonator for PURE DISTILLED WATER to feed water injector resonant cavity.

p.s. sorry about first post i use distilled water for battery is not pure then the leakage occur.SORRY about wrong thinking post.STAN always use concept"KISS" then NOW i think NO DIELECTRIC COATING IN WFC BECAUSE IT HARD TO MAKE(not KISS).BUT HEATER RESONATOR MAYBE HAS DIELECTRIC COATING.

DISTILLED WATER(100%PURE) IS THE KEY TO SUCCESS THE WORD "WATER CAPACITOR".

geenee    

resistance of pure water is 18 M Ohms/cm =1.8 M Ohms/mm

dielectric strength water is 70 M V/m= 70 K V/mm (dielectric break down voltage)

Hi, i found an interesting video on youtube today from a meyer newsreport regarding tube coating.

When they show his demostration cell it looks very much like the inner tubes are coated/conditioned, similar to Ravis. I attached a snapshop:).
Video: (Go to 04:38)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iehfe4-qGbw&feature=channel&list=UL

Oh. Great Work.Viktor94

if use natural water.the exciter plates need dielectric coating.

thanks
geenee

Here is a better picture. Clearly, there is no such coating.

Quote from Hydron on June 14th, 2012, 11:23 AM

Here is a better picture. Clearly, there is no such coating.

Thank you Hydron! now maybe we can move past this thing.

Quote from Davecbwfc on June 14th, 2012, 11:46 AM

Quote from Hydron on June 14th, 2012, 11:23 AM

Here is a better picture. Clearly, there is no such coating.

Thank you Hydron! now maybe we can move past this thing.

One last thing:  the tubes look like copper.  Are they or is there some other reason?

One more conspiracy. What if, somebody dissolved the coating whit acid for example? :dodgy:

Quote from pakakezu on June 14th, 2012, 03:56 PM

One more conspiracy. What if, somebody dissolved the coating whit acid for example? :dodgy:

The the brown iron oxide coating would also be cleaned off.

Quote from firepinto on June 14th, 2012, 04:40 PM

Quote from pakakezu on June 14th, 2012, 03:56 PM

One more conspiracy. What if, somebody dissolved the coating whit acid for example? :dodgy:

The the brown iron oxide coating would also be cleaned off.

Ah, that's why they look coppery.  Btw, what would happen if copper was used?

Quote from Hydron on June 14th, 2012, 11:23 AM

Here is a better picture. Clearly, there is no such coating.

Why is not the inside of the cell also covered with oxide? It appears like the inside has been covered with some sort of transparent coat, otherwise it should also have oxidized. Just a thought:huh:

Good discussion about dielectric property

http://www.overunity.com/9856/relative-permittivity-of-water/

geenee

I have been thinking about how current flow might be restricted in the cell during my travels this week.  The surface of the resonant cavity in the sparkplug injector is shown as having highly polished surfaces.  In current wet or dry cell electrolysis designs most people sand the plates with a cross-hatch pattern.  It is said that the ruff surface helps release the bubbles from the plates.  This allows more surface area for standard electrolysis to occur.  So what if, the polished surfaces are designed to capture the H and O gasses created by std electrolysis on their polorized tubes?  On the H side you would have an electrical insulator the thickness of one hydrogen atom in theory.  Same with the 0 side.  With having a good gas layer insulation I would suppose this is when bubbles forming between the tubes would occur.  With out having a surface to cling to the gasses combine with each other faster causing larger bubbles.  

My road trip daydream for the week. :). Think it would work?

Nate

Good information about dielectric property.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relative_permittivity

dielectric constant of water(100%pure) is about 80(at 20*C ,78.54 at 25*C) (by definition of VACUUM = 1) 80X than Vacuum

dielectric constant is not OHMS VALUE,Stan said"78.54 ohms",it 's not true.

oxide layer is dielectric for WFC.

natural water is not dielectric.

positive side is + plates,negative side is natural water,dielectric layer is oxide layer.

oxide layer pic from http://www.ritalie.com

geenee

Quote from firepinto on June 27th, 2012, 12:54 PM

I have been thinking about how current flow might be restricted in the cell during my travels this week.  The surface of the resonant cavity in the sparkplug injector is shown as having highly polished surfaces.  In current wet or dry cell electrolysis designs most people sand the plates with a cross-hatch pattern.  It is said that the ruff surface helps release the bubbles from the plates.  This allows more surface area for standard electrolysis to occur.  So what if, the polished surfaces are designed to capture the H and O gasses created by std electrolysis on their polorized tubes?  On the H side you would have an electrical insulator the thickness of one hydrogen atom in theory.  Same with the 0 side.  With having a good gas layer insulation I would suppose this is when bubbles forming between the tubes would occur.  With out having a surface to cling to the gasses combine with each other faster causing larger bubbles.  

My road trip daydream for the week. :). Think it would work?

Nate

I think that is a good hypothesis Nate, sounds very reasonable to me.:D

good clip about electrostatic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5w0IGuLR3A

-electrical charge(from electric power) to particle(smoke,smaller than ion=air),cause particle maintain electrical charge.from clip,when shutdown the smoke maintain electrical charge then power ball foams can stick the wall.

thanks
geenee