#### Sharky

##### Calculating resistance
« on March 7th, 2012, 12:16 AM »
When at resonance the imaginary part of the electrical impedance is zero. So the resistance of the water between the plates should be:

R = ρ*L/A

ρ sea water = 2×10−1 ohm*m
ρ drinking water = 2×101 to 2×103 ohm*m
ρ deionized water = 1.8×105 ohm*m
L Meyer Cell = 2.5 inch = 6.35 cm
Diameter inside = 0.5 inch = 1.27 cm → r = 0.635 cm
Diameter outside = 0.75 inch – (2*0.03 inch) = 0.69 inch = 1.7526 cm → r = 0.8763 cm
Gap = 0.095 inch = 0.2413 cm
Width Inside Meyer Cell = 2*π*r = 2* π * 0.635 = 3.98982  cm
Width Outside Meyer Cell = 2*π*r = π * 0.8763 = 5.50596 cm
A inside = 3.98982 * 6.35 = 25.34 cm2
A outside = 5.50596 * 6.35 = 34.96 cm2

So for drinking water the R should be between:
Rmin =   2×101 * 0.002413 / 0.002534 = 19 ohm
Rmax =   2×103 * 0.002413 / 0.003496 = 1380 ohm

Problem is still that since we use tubes what width do we use, inside or outside? Any comments/ideas?

#### ~Russ

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #1, on March 7th, 2012, 12:44 AM »Last edited on March 7th, 2012, 01:06 AM by ~Russ/Rwg42985
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 12:16 AM
Problem is still that since we use tubes what width do we use, inside or outside? Any comments/ideas?
i think this is worded odd for me to understand? what are you saying?

ok, i think i understand.

only use the tube that is exposed and also you will need to calculate both?  or the gap/ and the area between?

also please consider this tube as a wave guide... is there any calculations you can do with a wave guide that will help you calculate this out? there is some info in the Birth of a new tech book that talks a bout a wave guide. its memo WFC 427 "Voltage Wave Guide"

???

~Russ

PS. this wave guide section mainly talks about the Injector in my opinion... but i think it applys to all...

also look at pages 7-22 top photo " linear cylindrical resonant cavity " "linear Voltage Wave-Guide"

and sharky, look close at those diagrams in that chapter for coil tuning and impedance stuff and tuning???

#### Sharky

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #2, on March 7th, 2012, 01:41 AM »
Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on March 7th, 2012, 12:44 AM
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 12:16 AM
Problem is still that since we use tubes what width do we use, inside or outside? Any comments/ideas?
i think this is worded odd for me to understand? what are you saying?

ok, i think i understand.

only use the tube that is exposed and also you will need to calculate both?  or the gap/ and the area between?

also please consider this tube as a wave guide... is there any calculations you can do with a wave guide that will help you calculate this out? there is some info in the Birth of a new tech book that talks a bout a wave guide. its memo WFC 427 "Voltage Wave Guide"

???

~Russ

PS. this wave guide section mainly talks about the Injector in my opinion... but i think it applys to all...

also look at pages 7-22 top photo " linear cylindrical resonant cavity " "linear Voltage Wave-Guide"

and sharky, look close at those diagrams in that chapter for coil tuning and impedance stuff and tuning???
If you follow the link to wikipedia and take a look at the image shown there it may get clearer what i meant, ... in our case the surface area A is the plate surface area and l is the gap between the plates filled with water. Now since we have two cylindrical tubes with different diameters we get different values for A, the inner tube has a lower A than the outer tube so back to the image, one side is smaller than the other side and the water in between is actually some kind of trapezoid form instead of a cube. So calculating exactly the resistance is kind of difficult with the tube setup, it would be easier with the plate setup.

I will look more into the voltage wave guide stuff and impedance as i think it may be far more important than we have thought off until now, .... ay hurting my brain does (always loved Yoda) going back to all that theory and formulas from a past, far, ... far away

#### ~Russ

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #3, on March 7th, 2012, 03:33 AM »Last edited on March 7th, 2012, 03:35 AM by ~Russ/Rwg42985
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 01:41 AM
Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on March 7th, 2012, 12:44 AM
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 12:16 AM
Problem is still that since we use tubes what width do we use, inside or outside? Any comments/ideas?
i think this is worded odd for me to understand? what are you saying?

ok, i think i understand.

only use the tube that is exposed and also you will need to calculate both?  or the gap/ and the area between?

also please consider this tube as a wave guide... is there any calculations you can do with a wave guide that will help you calculate this out? there is some info in the Birth of a new tech book that talks a bout a wave guide. its memo WFC 427 "Voltage Wave Guide"

???

~Russ

PS. this wave guide section mainly talks about the Injector in my opinion... but i think it applys to all...

also look at pages 7-22 top photo " linear cylindrical resonant cavity " "linear Voltage Wave-Guide"

and sharky, look close at those diagrams in that chapter for coil tuning and impedance stuff and tuning???
If you follow the link to wikipedia and take a look at the image shown there it may get clearer what i meant, ... in our case the surface area A is the plate surface area and l is the gap between the plates filled with water. Now since we have two cylindrical tubes with different diameters we get different values for A, the inner tube has a lower A than the outer tube so back to the image, one side is smaller than the other side and the water in between is actually some kind of trapezoid form instead of a cube. So calculating exactly the resistance is kind of difficult with the tube setup, it would be easier with the plate setup.

I will look more into the voltage wave guide stuff and impedance as i think it may be far more important than we have thought off until now, .... ay hurting my brain does (always loved Yoda) going back to all that theory and formulas from a past, far, ... far away

http://www.phys.uri.edu/~gerhard/PHY204/tsl105.pdf

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/capcyl.html

http://www.davidpace.com/physics/em-topics/capacitance-cylinders.htm

and i don't know if this will help?
http://minerva.union.edu/labrakes/Capacitance%20and%20Resistance.pdf

any help?

i know your looking for resistance but... you may need to calculate capacitance then calculate resistance with that?

~Russ

#### panonoobis

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #4, on March 21st, 2012, 06:21 PM »Last edited on March 21st, 2012, 06:23 PM by panonoobis
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 01:41 AM
Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on March 7th, 2012, 12:44 AM
Quote from Sharky on March 7th, 2012, 12:16 AM
Problem is still that since we use tubes what width do we use, inside or outside? Any comments/ideas?
i think this is worded odd for me to understand? what are you saying?

ok, i think i understand.

only use the tube that is exposed and also you will need to calculate both?  or the gap/ and the area between?

also please consider this tube as a wave guide... is there any calculations you can do with a wave guide that will help you calculate this out? there is some info in the Birth of a new tech book that talks a bout a wave guide. its memo WFC 427 "Voltage Wave Guide"

???

~Russ

PS. this wave guide section mainly talks about the Injector in my opinion... but i think it applys to all...

also look at pages 7-22 top photo " linear cylindrical resonant cavity " "linear Voltage Wave-Guide"

and sharky, look close at those diagrams in that chapter for coil tuning and impedance stuff and tuning???
If you follow the link to wikipedia and take a look at the image shown there it may get clearer what i meant, ... in our case the surface area A is the plate surface area and l is the gap between the plates filled with water. Now since we have two cylindrical tubes with different diameters we get different values for A, the inner tube has a lower A than the outer tube so back to the image, one side is smaller than the other side and the water in between is actually some kind of trapezoid form instead of a cube. So calculating exactly the resistance is kind of difficult with the tube setup, it would be easier with the plate setup.

I will look more into the voltage wave guide stuff and impedance as i think it may be far more important than we have thought off until now, .... ay hurting my brain does (always loved Yoda) going back to all that theory and formulas from a past, far, ... far away
dident i se somting someware ware the outer tube has some gaps in tham to reduse the A af de outer to maths the inner tube's A ;) this whas dun becous of tuning,in som mayer youtube i have seen some time ago.

greets, pano

#### ~Russ

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #5, on March 24th, 2012, 08:04 PM »
attachment of what a wave guide is and how it works...

~Russ

#### securesupplies

##### RE: Calculating resistance
« Reply #6, on April 12th, 2012, 10:16 PM »
Quote from ~Russ/Rwg42985 on March 24th, 2012, 08:04 PM
attachment of what a wave guide is and how it works...

~Russ
Hi Guys

I find this one particulary good post RUSS

The wave guide infor is right on the money, and may open up new territory
several guys on line have posted they are getting result with straight microwave overn diodes and transformers this is very interesting post indeed.