Over the past week I've been comparing Stan Meyer's work with that of Andrija Puharich and experimenting with drive signals. Puharich released patents in the early 70's concerning high efficiency techniques for the electrolysis of water. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind now that Stan copied Puharich's work and it's basic operation in the splitting of the water molecule.
So why can't we get Stan or Andrija's techniques to work? The answer to that is a misunderstanding of the patents, a little secrecy from Stan and people not really grasping what Andrija Puharich is telling us.
So in a quick reference i'm going to suggest where we have all made errors. Firstly you can't just restrict current and throw voltage at this thing, been there and bought that t-shirt, even with high voltage at resonance it still will not work. The reason it will not work is because the water molecule at its natural Electron state will not accept change to it's structure. It will only accept change when the angle of the Electron changes from its natural state of 104 degrees to an angle of 109.28 degrees and the RC relaxation time constant of water in the cell is 3 seconds, that applies to Stan's designs too.
How do you achieve this?
Getting to the point and skipping all the different phases of Puharich's work: The reactance of your cell and VIC must be neutral so that the capacitive and inductive reactance cancel each other out at 4khz, the actual input frequency for the drive circuit will be 2khz with a diode and 4khz without a diode. You will modulate the carrier frequency so that the phases fit perfectly into a gate 'on' and the zero voltages correspond to TAU then you will introduce TAU or in Stan's case the gate. The gate will be set as follows: 90% duty cycle pulse so that the signal is 'on' for 90% of the gate and 10% off, the total length of the gate pulse on and pulse off is exactly 3 seconds. See below picture.
What does this do? It equals the RC relaxation time constant of water in the cell and changes the Electron angle from 104 to 109.28 degrees and makes the water easily split.
What happens next? The 4khz carrier wave produces 4 harmonics, the carrier wave drops 10hz and each harmonic follows suit mathematically, as soon as this happens the carrier and harmonics convert immediately into one pulse and this pulse is half rectified unipolar whether you have a diode present or not. When this happens the gate time is naturally halved and 50% of the trailing edge of the carrier wave disappears but adds to the voltage amplitude of the unipolar pulses accordingly. This process chops the sine wave carrier in half so that each unipolar pulse's voltage become exponential with time and frequency. The unipolar pulse splits the water but it is the TAU or gate and the four harmonics that totally destabilize it. Note that on the illustration that voltage is zero at both ends of the carrier wave inside the 90% gate 'on' time, this is to correspond with Puharich's zero to zero voltage of TAU. You can use other frequencies for the carrier and modulation PROVIDING that the phases of the carrier fit into the modulation perfectly so they start and end at zero voltage. However, those frequencies must be sub harmonic or harmonic of the carrier and modulation and the TAU (gate).
This is why we have no gas.

I wish Ronnie was still around to confirm this.

Anywho, give it a shot Nav and see what splits.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 29th, 2018, 01:45 PM

I wish Ronnie was still around to confirm this.

Anywho, give it a shot Nav and see what splits.

I'm busy day and night on a build. I've just been inputting the sig gen into various transformers and chokes at low voltage. Boy oh boy, the maths are difficult. You have to make sure the carrier fits in the modulation perfectly then the modulations fit into your 3 second burst perfectly. Duty cycle of the gate has significant impact on the phase of the carrier and modulation to the point of destruction of the signal. That's where the calculator comes out but get this: I've just found an absolutely amazing phenomenon, if you square wave modulate the carrier at the same frequency as the carrier then gate it, their appears harmonics that show up in the spectrum analyzer as a resonant half rectified sine wave and all have the same voltage amplitude on the center of the sine. And guess what, they are exactly where Puharich says they are. Surely they are not square wave modulating the carrier with the same frequency? I'll tell you what else happens too, when you square wave modulate the carrier with the same frequency without a gate it chops off the entire lower 180 degrees of the signal and half rectifies it. If you then play around with the gate for a while you can start to see Puharich's harmonics start modulating atop the carrier frequency, so far i've had 3 of those harmonics riding the carrier. This stuff is crazy, the signals are complex but understandable if we read Puharich's patent, if we're only willing to listen to him.

I'm still trying to get my head around the fact that i'd got a rectified signal in the upper 180 degrees of the scope that also showed up on my multimeter as dc and not ac BUT also on the scope was a resonant signal centered around the harmonics that was ac in form? How the hell can you have voltage going around a linear circuit in one direction but a modulation riding that very wave in both directions? It has to be a none linear signal like I discussed a few days ago.

Copied, compiled and saved for posterity.
Interesting, as always.
Many thanks for sharing Nav :thumbsup:

I commented about phases on another thread. i'll add those comments here for prosperity:-
Here is something rather interesting though. On one of Stan's schematics that Petkov copied, the three phases of an alternator are modulated separately as apposed to the three phase signal going into Stan's 9 tube array. That particular signal in the 9 tube array arrives at the switches as a complex 3 phase signal on two wires, modulating such a signal with the variac can only be done as a denominator of three without distorting the signal and the reactance of the cell has to be 3 sets of tubes per phase. If the tau or gate is 3 seconds then it all ends in good tidy maths don't you think? Getting back to what Petkov did, rather than combining the phases into a single modulated signal, he separates the three phases of the car alternator and modulates them separately but gets the gate wrong. He ends up with a 0.2 amp pulse and his voltage is swinging far too high to fit into this technology. But isn't it all rather interesting that you have THREE phases, you have 9 tube sets which works out at THREE per phase and you have THREE seconds of tau? This means in the 9 tube array that each phase represents 3 tube sets and each phase is exactly one third of tau? What you've actually got in essence is an entire system working in conjunction with tau and absolute proof that any system you build starts with how it all fits mathematically into tau.
From this you can apply rules: Any tube set's reactance must be a denominator of tau. If you have three phases then you can have 9 tube set arrays or 3 tube set arrays. If you are working off a single phase then the reactance dictates that you must either have a single tube or 3 tubes.

Posted: June 30th, 2018, 04:25 AM

It should be noted that if you are square pulse modulating the carrier frequency with the same frequency then your common denominater is 1. If a denominator is 1 then the duty cycle width's 00.1, 33.3, 66.6 and 99.9% have special significance. Below is the half rectified signal at 33.3% duty cycle where relevant harmonics appear.

Not long ago I would have laughed to see this circuit, but not anymore.  That hanging wire connected to nothing guarantees you have a neutral current condition.  Only the modulated signal makes it to the cell.

Quote from Matt Watts on June 30th, 2018, 08:45 AM

Not long ago I would have laughed to see this circuit, but not anymore.  That hanging wire connected to nothing guarantees you have a neutral current condition.  Only the modulated signal makes it to the cell.

Matt, Puharich has no pickup coil so he uses one secondary across ground through a resistor to PLL the modulator circuit. He does this because the system changes frequency at different stages of electrolysis and he wants it to remain resonant. His resonance is impedance matching the load to the source at all times.
But...forgetting the tau or gate for a minute or two lets discuss the VIC and cell relationship on Puharich's system. He has single phase and one cell which fits into the ratio rule of thumb above concerning the denominator of three which I stated. Because the carrier and modulation frequencies vary by such a large degree it would be impossible to match the cell to his VIC at one particular frequency. For example on Puharich's dry run in the patent, the carrier frequency is approx 66khz changing to between 1200 and 1800hz with a tiny amount of water touching the electrodes yet the system remains resonant. That tells you right away that the cell and VIC's relationship has nothing to do with normal LC resonance as we know it because the capacitive reactance of the cell and inductive reactance of the VIC would not tally at such a massive variance of drive frequency. Therefore we must assume that the relationship of the cell to the VIC in both Puharich and Stan's design is just pure reactance that is cancelling across a wide degree of frequencies. Stan states in his patent that adding more windings to his positive choke easily produces more voltage because the inductive properties of the choke and the capacitance in the windings are equally cancelling but he never mentions it's reactance to the cell if you do this especially at different frequencies. Stan's three phase 9 cell array modulated by a variac would be close to impossible the tune to those tubes across differing frequencies, it would be akin to tuning an antenna to a varying AM transmission without the use of automatic antenna tuner. So how are they doing it?
The answer is simple, Their systems are tuned to the carrier frequency 3980hz and no amount of change in the gate or modulation of the circuit can affect the fundamental carrier in any transmission line or otherwise. That is why Puharich in the picture you posted above Matt is actually PLLing the modulations and not the carrier. The system will be out of tune during the early part of the process and that is why both Stan and Puharich keep the voltages down in the early stages, then ramp it up as the system enters resonance.
So in essence to tune the cell to the VIC, you would have no standing waves between the two at 3980hz. To achieve this you can make the negative choke variable and test at very low voltage OR if you are using a bifilar choke arrangement in your system you would need to make the capacitive reactance of the cell variable with the introduction of a gamma match.

Tuning the lc tank cell is part of the circuit tune ?

==========================================

Like this
The answer is simple,

Their systems are tuned to the carrier frequency 3980hz and no amount of change in the gate or modulation of the circuit can affect the fundamental carrier in any transmission line or otherwise.

That is why Puharich in the picture you posted above Matt is actually PLLing the modulations and not the carrier.

The system will be out of tune during the early part of the process and that is why both Stan and Puharich keep the voltages down in the early stages, then ramp it up as the system enters resonance.

So in essence to tune the cell to the VIC,
you would have no standing waves between the two at 3980hz.

To achieve this you can make the negative choke variable and test at very low voltage
 OR
if you are using a bifilar choke arrangement in your system you would need to make the capacitive reactance of the cell variable with the introduction of a gamma match.

 
Picture Above show variable choke

Quote from securesupplies on July 1st, 2018, 11:36 PM

Picture Above show variable choke

Yes. But you need to remember one thing only in tuning the cell: If the cell has too high impedance for the VIC then you change the inductive reactance of L2, if the impedance of the cell is too low then you change the capacitive reactance of the cell. Prime example: Spark plug design of Stan's has a impedance of between 5000 and 7000ohms. How do we know this? Because Stan uses the same voltage to drive the spark gap as he does to operate the gas production (well I think he does but correct me if i'm wrong). Spark plugs operate at between 5000 and 7000ohms to produce enough juice to ignite fuel properly so you would have to assume Stan's gap between the electrodes on gas production is also the same. This presents a problem because Stan's primary on that circuit is 21ohms @ 1khz and roughly 300-400ohms @ 5Khz. A ten to one impedance mismatch. This means Stan will need to tap the L2 choke at perhaps 350ohm tapping point.
Opposite end of the spectrum, you have his 9 cell tube array with an impedance in the Mega ohms or possibly less in the Kilo ohms. There is no way on earth you can tap that kind of impedance out of a dc ground, the coil would have to be the size of a football and besides he's using a car alternator. Puharich does it by adding electrolyte to the water and bringing it's dc resistance down, lowering the impedance of his cell according.
Since we don't know the combined impedance of Stan's alternator and variac it's hard to determine how far he's lowering the cell impedance to match the rest of his design BUT the one thing we do know is that the frequency of the variac after it goes through the full bridge rectifier is 120hz and his alternator is approx 360hz which is a three to one ratio so each set of three tubes sets has to match the impedance of one phase. It is not easy to calculate the tube impedance @x frequency without extremely expensive equipment. Stan through his own experience though will know how much dc resistance is needed in each tube set in tap water. We can't do this because we don't know how frequency affects tubes compared to their dc resistance (reactance). There are no calculations to do so. There is with inductance in coils but not with massive tube in tube capacitor designs.

...Or you could actually put resistors across the primary terminals if you can't get the cell in the ball park and then fine tune it with either inductive reactance or capacitive reactance. This way the source impedance see's a match. In this way you could have a cell in the Kilo ohms dc resistance that actually equates to 2000ohms @ resonance (depending on the dc resistance of the water itself) and you use resistors across the primary to bring that down in conjunction with a dc tap on L2.

In the case of a cell that is in the mega ohms, it is quite interesting that something that high in parallel with another resistor if we are looking at the cell as a purely resistive circuit, would show the source impedance the same value as the resistor you place in parallel to it BUT of course we are not talking about a purely resistive component, we are talking about a reactive component. Regardless of that fact though, placing resistors across the primary does effect what the source actually see's.

Prime example of that is an RF dummy load made of banks of resistors. Normally the radio see's a reactive element where inductance and capacitance form a 50ohm load, the dummy load however uses resistive components to mimic the 50ohm impedance. The radio is still happy and cannot tell the two different methods apart. In the case of a cell using 20kv+ voltage it would be difficult to place a resistor across the cell but easier to place one across the primary terminals.

how about refining the cap to be in a consistent range and hold voltage range  in the cell with quartz tube lining inside  cathode?

Quote from securesupplies on July 3rd, 2018, 06:26 AM

how about refining the cap to be in a consistent range and hold voltage range  in the cell with quartz tube lining inside  cathode?

That is what Puharich is doing, he can vary his capacitance with different dielectrics and electrolytes.

and Glass/quartz insert (like ozonators do)

dbd Barrier

https://youtu.be/jIcQ3Ud-jqU