Just posting to say hello and tell you a little about myself. I've been interested in HHO and Meyer technology for a couple of years and just recently i've taken the plunge and started to build my own system. I'm not going for the brute force method of electrolysis but rather Meyers low energy input system.
I've build most of the front end of my device with PWM's. Based on a NEC555 for the main pulse and K8004 for the gating together with Optocouplers and a couple of Mosfets to isolate the PWM's from the main voltage supply.
Built a system also that allows me to use a PC as a scope which is up and running.
Not built my secondary circuit yet with the voltage intensifier, the coils and the fuel cell but have had the PWM coupled up to a test cell at 7vcd brute force method and had significant gas production in tap water at 1.2amps. I did that test because I was curious if I could produce gas in tap water with normal electrolysis which I did.
I've been building the system for about a month and next week I will be starting work  on a pair of resonant coils. My cell and coil RF will be around the 17Khz range and the gating based on one eighth of that frequency round about 2.1Khz.
My cells are around 19600mm2 (total cell surface area) flat plate with the negative plate coated in Delrin 500 and the positive plates left bare at a plate spacing of 1.5mm between them. Hope to be doing some testing in the next few weeks or months depending how it goes.

Hi Nav, welcome
Good luck in your quest, looking forward to see your progress here

Quote from Lynx on March 10th, 2013, 12:02 PM

Hi Nav, welcome
Good luck in your quest, looking forward to see your progress here

Thankyou Lynx, Just thought i'd post my schematic of my front end for all to see.

Here is the secondary part of my system.

Quote from nav on March 10th, 2013, 01:33 PM

Here is the secondary part of my system.

Very interesting design with the water actually circulating through the choke coils.  If this magnetically polarizes the H and OH ions, I would expect it to have some effect on the electrical polarization as well.  Let us know if you see such effect either with current draw, gas production rate or both.

Again, welcome to OpenSource Energy nav.

Hi Dog-one,
I see this system doing 2 things. There are associated problems with gas saturating the water and not being able to escape quick enough for usage. I also believe that the gas bubbles entering the magnetic field north and south will change their state and release from the water quicker on re-entry into the cell tank.

Your suspicion here is that magnetic fields play a key role in the transformation process.  As I mentioned in the other thread, my opinion is that we need to understand what forces are holding the water together in liquid form and then attempt to oppose those forces to fracture the water.  Very likely this can be done with minimal power consumption, but we do need to know what makes water liquid in the first place.  Any chance you have some reference material that would enlighten my understanding?  From a chemical and physics standpoint.

Also, in your secondary circuit above, I do not see any current flow if your negative plates are coated.  Would this not kill any chance of generating a magnet field in those two choke coils?

Quote from Dog-One on March 10th, 2013, 04:34 PM

Your suspicion here is that magnetic fields play a key role in the transformation process.  As I mentioned in the other thread, my opinion is that we need to understand what forces are holding the water together in liquid form and then attempt to oppose those forces to fracture the water.  Very likely this can be done with minimal power consumption, but we do need to know what makes water liquid in the first place.  Any chance you have some reference material that would enlighten my understanding?  From a chemical and physics standpoint.

Also, in your secondary circuit above, I do not see any current flow if your negative plates are coated.  Would this not kill any chance of generating a magnet field in those two choke coils?

Hi dog-one
My understanding is that water is held together just the same as any other molecule out there. There is an electrical balance between the H and O just the same as the balance between a Proton and an Electron in an atom. However the H and O share Electrons from the outer Electron shell which form part of a balancing act. It seems to me that in conventional Electrolysis and Meyer technology we upset the balance of the electrical charge by allowing the molecule to enter a charged field which causes the migration of critical components of this balancing act.

I myself can not go along with coating the inner workings of the tubes or plates. But I am not here to say it may not work. Stan only talkes about delrin as an encasment on the outside of the outer electrode. All photos of what we have of his so called working models that he used to run his buggy is not coated. His plate cell showes no signs of delrin at all. His first tube cell that ran with the alternator has no coating on the inside or delrin at all. His last array cell is the only cell that has delrin, Everything is made of delrin even the tubes are encased in delrin but no delrin inside the tubes. They are many ways i am sure to skin this cat, but coating the tubes to me is not one of them. My tubes were not coated when I got it to work. I know i have no way proving this to anyone, But I didnt need to coat them so i am sticking with what i know that worked. I have just about figured out the VIC and how it works. One thing i do agree with is that you can use any frequency you want as long as you build the VIC around that frequency.

AS FOREST GUMP WOULD SAY "THAT'S ALL I GOT TO SAY ABOUT THAT" :D

Quote from gpssonar on March 10th, 2013, 05:23 PM

I myself can not go along with coating the inner workings of the tubes or plates. But I am not here to say it may not work. Stan only talkes about delrin as an encasment on the outside of the outer electrode. All photos of what we have of his so called working models that he used to run his buggy is not coated. His plate cell showes no signs of delrin at all. His first tube cell that ran with the alternator has no coating on the inside or delrin at all. His last array cell is the only cell that has delrin, Everything is made of delrin even the tubes are encased in delrin but no delrin inside the tubes. They are many ways i am sure to skin this cat, but coating the tubes to me is not one of them. My tubes were not coated when I got it to work. I know i have no way proving this to anyone, But I didnt need to coat them so i am sticking with what i know that worked. I have just about figured out the VIC and how it works. One thing i do agree with is that you can use any frequency you want as long as you build the VIC around that frequency.

AS FOREST GUMP WOULD SAY "THAT'S ALL I GOT TO SAY ABOUT THAT" :D

Hi gpssonar,
I'm not going to say that it cannot be done with uncoated plates because I simply don't know that fact. All I am saying is that Stan Meyer said many times that his system works with tap water, sea water, rain water and distilled water. Now imagine if you have a couple of thousand volts across your plates and you introduce sea water into the fray. Sea water contains salts of Magnesium and is a very good conductor of current. There is no way on Gods Earth you could keep the voltage on those plates without a voltage breakdown of the cap and the dielectric. Then it becomes brute force and current inducing. Tap water would have a similar reaction owing to the fact it contains salts of various kinds like Fluoride and Chlorine which again conduct current across the cap.
Meyer creates an Electric field where he has dielectric stability and I see no way to achieve this unless you were using low voltage in the millivolts range.
Think about it!:idea:

Quote from nav on March 10th, 2013, 05:56 PM

Quote from gpssonar on March 10th, 2013, 05:23 PM

I myself can not go along with coating the inner workings of the tubes or plates. But I am not here to say it may not work. Stan only talkes about delrin as an encasment on the outside of the outer electrode. All photos of what we have of his so called working models that he used to run his buggy is not coated. His plate cell showes no signs of delrin at all. His first tube cell that ran with the alternator has no coating on the inside or delrin at all. His last array cell is the only cell that has delrin, Everything is made of delrin even the tubes are encased in delrin but no delrin inside the tubes. They are many ways i am sure to skin this cat, but coating the tubes to me is not one of them. My tubes were not coated when I got it to work. I know i have no way proving this to anyone, But I didnt need to coat them so i am sticking with what i know that worked. I have just about figured out the VIC and how it works. One thing i do agree with is that you can use any frequency you want as long as you build the VIC around that frequency.

AS FOREST GUMP WOULD SAY "THAT'S ALL I GOT TO SAY ABOUT THAT" :D

Hi gpssonar,
I'm not going to say that it cannot be done with uncoated plates because I simply don't know that fact. All I am saying is that Stan Meyer said many times that his system works with tap water, sea water, rain water and distilled water. Now imagine if you have a couple of thousand volts across your plates and you introduce sea water into the fray. Sea water contains salts of Magnesium and is a very good conductor of current. There is no way on Gods Earth you could keep the voltage on those plates without a voltage breakdown of the cap and the dielectric. Then it becomes brute force and current inducing. Tap water would have a similar reaction owing to the fact it contains salts of various kinds like Fluoride and Chlorine which again conduct current across the cap.
Meyer creates an Electric field where he has dielectric stability and I see no way to achieve this unless you were using low voltage in the millivolts range.
Think about it!:idea:

I realize what you are saying and i have thought about it, BUT STAN ALSO SAYS TUNE INTO THE DIELECTRIC PROPERTIES OF WATER. (NOTICE HE DID"T SAY PROPERTY OF WATER), WHAT HE IS TUNING INTO IS THE DISSOLVED GASES IN THE WATER "WATER MOLECULE". NOT ALL THE OTHER THINGS YOU SAY THAT IS IN THE WATER. There are so many people not seeing this.

Quote from gpssonar on March 10th, 2013, 07:25 PM

Quote from nav on March 10th, 2013, 05:56 PM

Quote from gpssonar on March 10th, 2013, 05:23 PM

I myself can not go along with coating the inner workings of the tubes or plates. But I am not here to say it may not work. Stan only talkes about delrin as an encasment on the outside of the outer electrode. All photos of what we have of his so called working models that he used to run his buggy is not coated. His plate cell showes no signs of delrin at all. His first tube cell that ran with the alternator has no coating on the inside or delrin at all. His last array cell is the only cell that has delrin, Everything is made of delrin even the tubes are encased in delrin but no delrin inside the tubes. They are many ways i am sure to skin this cat, but coating the tubes to me is not one of them. My tubes were not coated when I got it to work. I know i have no way proving this to anyone, But I didnt need to coat them so i am sticking with what i know that worked. I have just about figured out the VIC and how it works. One thing i do agree with is that you can use any frequency you want as long as you build the VIC around that frequency.

AS FOREST GUMP WOULD SAY "THAT'S ALL I GOT TO SAY ABOUT THAT" :D

Hi gpssonar,
I'm not going to say that it cannot be done with uncoated plates because I simply don't know that fact. All I am saying is that Stan Meyer said many times that his system works with tap water, sea water, rain water and distilled water. Now imagine if you have a couple of thousand volts across your plates and you introduce sea water into the fray. Sea water contains salts of Magnesium and is a very good conductor of current. There is no way on Gods Earth you could keep the voltage on those plates without a voltage breakdown of the cap and the dielectric. Then it becomes brute force and current inducing. Tap water would have a similar reaction owing to the fact it contains salts of various kinds like Fluoride and Chlorine which again conduct current across the cap.
Meyer creates an Electric field where he has dielectric stability and I see no way to achieve this unless you were using low voltage in the millivolts range.
Think about it!:idea:

I realize what you are saying and i have thought about it, BUT STAN ALSO SAYS TUNE INTO THE DIELECTRIC PROPERTIES OF WATER. (NOTICE HE DID"T SAY PROPERTY OF WATER), WHAT HE IS TUNING INTO IS THE DISSOLVED GASES IN THE WATER "WATER MOLECULE". NOT ALL THE OTHER THINGS YOU SAY THAT IS IN THE WATER. There are so many people not seeing this.

Hi gpssonar,
Exactly! Tune into the dielectric properties of water not the breakdown voltage. IMHO not having a plate insulated is admittance that the plates are not acting as a capacitor but a pair of electrodes.

I realy dont know what to call them yet. Stan calls them capacitors, his brother says they act more like a transistor. so right now i am just calling it a confined space to work on the water molecule and i can change the confined space with the gap and or lenght.

Quote from gpssonar on March 11th, 2013, 02:32 PM

I realy dont know what to call them yet. Stan calls them capacitors, his brother says they act more like a transistor. so right now i am just calling it a confined space to work on the water molecule and i can change the confined space with the gap and or lenght.

Resonant cavity works for me.   ;)

What causes current to flow across the water? Highly mobile IONs? What if the polarization process was able to lock the water molecules from freely moving and forms a barrier to the current. Then the more the current is restricted the higher the voltage could rise. Maybe an electrically induced exclusion zone that forces the impurities out of the barrier zone.

I believe the secret is that Stan found a way to make the water not conduct electricity.

Quote from DanB on March 11th, 2013, 04:36 PM

What causes current to flow across the water? Highly mobile IONs? What if the polarization process was able to lock the water molecules from freely moving and forms a barrier to the current. Then the more the current is restricted the higher the voltage could rise. Maybe an electrically induced exclusion zone that forces the impurities out of the barrier zone.

I believe the secret is that Stan found a way to make the water not conduct electricity.

Hi DanB,
Current flow is caused by conductive salts in the water therefore all experiments concerning Meyer effect should be performed realistically with distilled water and not tap water or anything in or above the same conductivity range. That will eliminate the brute force effect at lower voltages. At higher voltages such as Kv ranges, dielectric breakdown could possibly occur due to arcing and the creation of a plasma field within the plates. I haven't seen UV from plasma fields in SM's experiments and videos but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist due to current leakage at some point. If Meyer were using Kv's in distilled water then he must reach a voltage point across the plates just before dielectric breakdown occurs and has the potential to cause current flow through a plasma field.
We already know the results of 30Kv in distilled water and its not where we want to be IMO.
Meyer does indeed know the secret of how to create an Electric field which has an infinite voltage potential across the plates. The reason it doesn't reach breakdown voltage is a pure timing issue. The voltage is doing work in the water at the same rate at which he charges the plates. This is why he has a phase lock loop system deployed into the mix. The dielectric potential of the water is changing constantly as the gas is extracted and creating a moving target or workload. If you don't phase lock the work load to the variable dielectric constant of the water then the system will  become out of sink with the timing of the resonant chokes and capacitor. The tank circuit has to respond to the work load and the work load responds to the changing dielectric property of the water. In essence the variable inductor or resonant charging choke is phase locked to the dielectric property of the water via a sensor in the water. That is why on Meyers schematic he has a variable inductor in series with the cap. So the frequency of the tank circuit will vary according to the work load in the water which is responding to the dielectric value. The phase lock system picks the varying dielectric property of the water up via a sensor circuit then the phase lock varies the frequency of the frequency generator accordingly. Its all about PERFECT TIMING imho.

Keep in mind what gps said too, that being you make very small voltage increments at first, retuning with each increment.  After you get above about 12 volts, the tuning seems to lock and will jump straight to gas production without any further retuning from a cold start.  I have never witnessed this myself, but if gps says that is how it worked for him, we should probably consider this good info to work from.  What I don't recall is which way the tuning went--higher or lower frequency with each small voltage interval.  It may also be cell dependent.