Quote from nav on June 10th, 2013, 03:34 PM

Its looking more and more like Meyer stole Tesla technology and didn't know what the hell he was talking about when explaining it. I think we are actually going somewhere with this.

Ya know... very interesting.

Found this link... might be worth looking into.
http://www.teslauniverse.com/nikola-tesla-patents-568,176-producing-high-frequency-currents

Quote from Ravenous Emu on June 9th, 2013, 06:27 AM

Quote from Lynx on May 20th, 2013, 07:49 AM

PREFACE:
I didn't thoroughly read all the posts and some one probably already mentioned this.
What caught my eye was the "0V" and the "Isolated Ground"

Nav, on the first pic  (Figure 8-10 VIC Sync Pulse Circuit)
It seems to indicate that the secondary has a center tap.  In which one side is hooked to the cell. The center tap, the way I understand it, would be isolated and is being used as his electron extraction circuit.

Thought:
What if the reason he's using a "tuned inductor" is because he's also using it as part of his electron extraction circuit?
In a way, switching between the "negative choke" to the "amp inhibiting coil".
What do you guys think?

Quote from wfchobby on May 20th, 2013, 07:11 AM

Hi lads, interesting thread. A curiosity is the " ground" and " is the isolated ground important" ?
could that be a plausible circuit path for the questions about the " ground" in the discussion in above posts in this thread???

Should've read through these posts.  I think that post answers a part of my question.
:D :cool: :P

I think the water gap is the 0 reference on his scope,from 0v ''water gap'' to cathode is negative  unipolar crossover voltage ,and from 0v ''water gap'' to anode is positive unipolar crossover voltage.If you put the scope on the anode and cathode you cannot see the negative and positive separated.I might be wrong but that 0v reference is repeating in the 3 scopeshots.Cheers!

Quote from geenee on June 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Great picture,root.locus.

very clearly.We need a new thought about longitudinal wave and new science.

longitudinal wave = static shock wave from switch or spark gap or coil shorting.this wave is faster than speed of light.

resonant charging chokes,this coils stop transverse wave and show only longitudinal wave,result is lower amps consumption.

but Meyer use diode,this is very difference.

thanks for sharing
geenee

THe diode Meyer used, has the same effect as the Tesla`s spark gap. But, as we are dealing with explosive gases, the spark gap its not a good idea...

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 08:06 AM

Quote from geenee on June 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Great picture,root.locus.

very clearly.We need a new thought about longitudinal wave and new science.

longitudinal wave = static shock wave from switch or spark gap or coil shorting.this wave is faster than speed of light.

resonant charging chokes,this coils stop transverse wave and show only longitudinal wave,result is lower amps consumption.

but Meyer use diode,this is very difference.

thanks for sharing
geenee

THe diode Meyer used, has the same effect as the Tesla`s spark gap. But, as we are dealing with explosive gases, the spark gap its not a good idea...

Yup, good point. I've also been studying the inductors on both patents and it could well be that their main job is not one half of a tank circuit as specified by others. Stan calls them chokes and I believe he does so for a reason.
In radio we use chokes to both remove unwanted common mode currents on a radiator and to determine a certain electrical length of a radiator.
Imagine that the isolated ground rod is one half of a dipole system which gathers radiant energy, it will have a certain electrical length and the choke is an excellent tool for determining that very length. So in essence the chokes are determining the electrical length of a dipole. Tom Bearden has mentioned in related theory 'don't kill the dipole'. I think I know where he's coming from.
We are talking about harmonic relationships in the length of the wires coming from the capacitor to the inductors and the electrical length of those inductors with velocity factor included in the equation. Ladies and gentlemen, the reason no one can get this to work is because no one is working with electrical lengths and harmonic related technology. In my opinion it cannot work because people are 'killing the dipole'.

Quote from nav on June 11th, 2013, 09:09 AM

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 08:06 AM

Quote from geenee on June 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Great picture,root.locus.

very clearly.We need a new thought about longitudinal wave and new science.

longitudinal wave = static shock wave from switch or spark gap or coil shorting.this wave is faster than speed of light.

resonant charging chokes,this coils stop transverse wave and show only longitudinal wave,result is lower amps consumption.

but Meyer use diode,this is very difference.

thanks for sharing
geenee

THe diode Meyer used, has the same effect as the Tesla`s spark gap. But, as we are dealing with explosive gases, the spark gap its not a good idea...

Yup, good point. I've also been studying the inductors on both patents and it could well be that their main job is not one half of a tank circuit as specified by others. Stan calls them chokes and I believe he does so for a reason.
In radio we use chokes to both remove unwanted common mode currents on a radiator and to determine a certain electrical length of a radiator.
Imagine that the isolated ground rod is one half of a dipole system which gathers radiant energy, it will have a certain electrical length and the choke is an excellent tool for determining that very length. So in essence the chokes are determining the electrical length of a dipole. Tom Bearden has mentioned in related theory 'don't kill the dipole'. I think I know where he's coming from.
We are talking about harmonic relationships in the length of the wires coming from the capacitor to the inductors and the electrical length of those inductors with velocity factor included in the equation. Ladies and gentlemen, the reason no one can get this to work is because no one is working with electrical lengths and harmonic related technology. In my opinion it cannot work because people are 'killing the dipole'.

The chokes are for signal phasing. So in the WFC, you have 2 signals 180º phased from each other. When you have this, you have a scalar field, that generates a scalar wave. You have to "cancel" the vectorial waves, so you only have scalar waves. The tesla magnifier transmitter had 1 primary coil, 1 secondary coil and 1 additional coil, to transmit scalar waves.
That`s why stan uses a bifilar coil, to cancel the vectorial fields.
Don`t you ever asked yourself "when two identical signals are 180 out of phase from each other, they cancel each other. But, what happends to the signals energy, if the energy cant be created nor destroyed?"

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 09:15 AM

Quote from nav on June 11th, 2013, 09:09 AM

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 08:06 AM

Quote from geenee on June 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Great picture,root.locus.

very clearly.We need a new thought about longitudinal wave and new science.

longitudinal wave = static shock wave from switch or spark gap or coil shorting.this wave is faster than speed of light.

resonant charging chokes,this coils stop transverse wave and show only longitudinal wave,result is lower amps consumption.

but Meyer use diode,this is very difference.

thanks for sharing
geenee

THe diode Meyer used, has the same effect as the Tesla`s spark gap. But, as we are dealing with explosive gases, the spark gap its not a good idea...

Yup, good point. I've also been studying the inductors on both patents and it could well be that their main job is not one half of a tank circuit as specified by others. Stan calls them chokes and I believe he does so for a reason.
In radio we use chokes to both remove unwanted common mode currents on a radiator and to determine a certain electrical length of a radiator.
Imagine that the isolated ground rod is one half of a dipole system which gathers radiant energy, it will have a certain electrical length and the choke is an excellent tool for determining that very length. So in essence the chokes are determining the electrical length of a dipole. Tom Bearden has mentioned in related theory 'don't kill the dipole'. I think I know where he's coming from.
We are talking about harmonic relationships in the length of the wires coming from the capacitor to the inductors and the electrical length of those inductors with velocity factor included in the equation. Ladies and gentlemen, the reason no one can get this to work is because no one is working with electrical lengths and harmonic related technology. In my opinion it cannot work because people are 'killing the dipole'.

The chokes are for signal phasing. So in the WFC, you have 2 signals 180º phased from each other. When you have this, you have a scalar field, that generates a scalar wave. You have to "cancel" the vectorial waves, so you only have scalar waves. The tesla magnifier transmitter had 1 primary coil, 1 secondary coil and 1 additional coil, to transmit scalar waves.
That`s why stan uses a bifilar coil, to cancel the vectorial fields.
Don`t you ever asked yourself "when two identical signals are 180 out of phase from each other, they cancel each other. But, what happends to the signals energy, if the energy cant be created nor destroyed?"

It gets reflected back into the source as a standing waveI've just drawn this quickly to show what i'm talking about.
[attachment=3838]
Forget about the transformer or the PWM/rotary contact breaker for a second. The length of the wire from the source to the end of the coil before it goes to the cap is a resonant electrical length probably an harmonic of radiant energy. I have marked it as 'RL' (resonant length) at the top of the picture. This is why Stan calls them resonant chokes. Then the lower choke has a tap point which is DC grounded exactly the same as a shunt fed antenna system. What is taking place there is we are tapping into an electrical length because the ground rod is quite long and is different from the other half of the dipole so we are tuning it to the same resonance. The chokes will naturally act as inductors in conjunction with the cap and form a tank circuit but their electrical length must be determined by the dipole specs not the tank circuit.
The whole system creates a potential of cold electricity on one of the cap plates and nature does the rest placing an equal but opposite charge on the other cap plate. All we do in this system is to stimulate one half of the system into vibrating. Its like radio where we set an antenna up to listen at a certain frequency or resonance then wait for the energy to hit our antenna. All we do is provide the tuned circuit using hardly any power to drive it because its only listening and not transmitting. If we use current then we are trying to transmit.

Can you explain about electrical length? wire length or not??

thanks
geenee

If you happen to study the Tetryonics stuff at all, Matter IS a standing wave of energy.  All Matter, i.e. electrons (12 sided equilateral triangles composed of bosons) too.  You create the proper variation to the standing wave of Matter and potentially you can break apart the Matter into pure energy.  Or go the other way and arrange a standing wave of energy into the proper form and you get Matter (electrons) in return.  What we are after doesn't seem at all far fetched when you see the quantum mechanics of how it might work.

....Or perhaps this is the resonant electrical length in blue.
[attachment=3839]
It may be the electrical length we need is between the diode and the cap on the top and between the tapping point and the cap at the bottom. Were into new territory here so bare with me.
geenee, electrical length is the length of a radiator that is resonant minus the velocity factor of the material used. For example in an antenna, if an half wave length antenna used at 27Mhz is 17.5 feet long including its matching coil that is its electrical length. If the material used can transport electricity at perhaps 98% the speed of light then it has a velocity factor of 98%. But because the antenna is reactive towards the speed of light then VF interferes with the phase of the antenna therefore we have to set the antenna's electrical length by shortening its physical length too, we call it electrical length because in antenna matching systems we have tuning coils and chokes that don't form a physical visible length. But we must include the entire length of any such choke or inductor in its electrical length.
Perhaps this whole dipole system's electrical length is set to the Shuman resonance, once you get it built then its a matter of energizing the inductors to be able to except cold energy.

Quote from nav on June 11th, 2013, 09:32 AM

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 09:15 AM

Quote from nav on June 11th, 2013, 09:09 AM

Quote from root.locus on June 11th, 2013, 08:06 AM

Quote from geenee on June 10th, 2013, 05:03 PM

Great picture,root.locus.

very clearly.We need a new thought about longitudinal wave and new science.

longitudinal wave = static shock wave from switch or spark gap or coil shorting.this wave is faster than speed of light.

resonant charging chokes,this coils stop transverse wave and show only longitudinal wave,result is lower amps consumption.

but Meyer use diode,this is very difference.

thanks for sharing
geenee

THe diode Meyer used, has the same effect as the Tesla`s spark gap. But, as we are dealing with explosive gases, the spark gap its not a good idea...

Yup, good point. I've also been studying the inductors on both patents and it could well be that their main job is not one half of a tank circuit as specified by others. Stan calls them chokes and I believe he does so for a reason.
In radio we use chokes to both remove unwanted common mode currents on a radiator and to determine a certain electrical length of a radiator.
Imagine that the isolated ground rod is one half of a dipole system which gathers radiant energy, it will have a certain electrical length and the choke is an excellent tool for determining that very length. So in essence the chokes are determining the electrical length of a dipole. Tom Bearden has mentioned in related theory 'don't kill the dipole'. I think I know where he's coming from.
We are talking about harmonic relationships in the length of the wires coming from the capacitor to the inductors and the electrical length of those inductors with velocity factor included in the equation. Ladies and gentlemen, the reason no one can get this to work is because no one is working with electrical lengths and harmonic related technology. In my opinion it cannot work because people are 'killing the dipole'.

The chokes are for signal phasing. So in the WFC, you have 2 signals 180º phased from each other. When you have this, you have a scalar field, that generates a scalar wave. You have to "cancel" the vectorial waves, so you only have scalar waves. The tesla magnifier transmitter had 1 primary coil, 1 secondary coil and 1 additional coil, to transmit scalar waves.
That`s why stan uses a bifilar coil, to cancel the vectorial fields.
Don`t you ever asked yourself "when two identical signals are 180 out of phase from each other, they cancel each other. But, what happends to the signals energy, if the energy cant be created nor destroyed?"

It gets reflected back into the source as a standing waveI've just drawn this quickly to show what i'm talking about.

Forget about the transformer or the PWM/rotary contact breaker for a second. The length of the wire from the source to the end of the coil before it goes to the cap is a resonant electrical length probably an harmonic of radiant energy. I have marked it as 'RL' (resonant length) at the top of the picture. This is why Stan calls them resonant chokes. Then the lower choke has a tap point which is DC grounded exactly the same as a shunt fed antenna system. What is taking place there is we are tapping into an electrical length because the ground rod is quite long and is different from the other half of the dipole so we are tuning it to the same resonance. The chokes will naturally act as inductors in conjunction with the cap and form a tank circuit but their electrical length must be determined by the dipole specs not the tank circuit.
The whole system creates a potential of cold electricity on one of the cap plates and nature does the rest placing an equal but opposite charge on the other cap plate. All we do in this system is to stimulate one half of the system into vibrating. Its like radio where we set an antenna up to listen at a certain frequency or resonance then wait for the energy to hit our antenna. All we do is provide the tuned circuit using hardly any power to drive it because its only listening and not transmitting. If we use current then we are trying to transmit.

See this link:
Standing Wave Animation

When you have 2 signals out of phase, you dont have a standing wave. You only have a standing wave when the phases of the direct and reflected signal are the same.
When you cancel 2 waves you got a scalar field that generates a scalar wave (it`s effects I don`t know for sure).
The signal it`s a resonant signal, not a natural resonance, but a gated resonance. The 2 chokes and the cell are not grounded (in some drawings stans show some grounding, but the circuit was for the processor, not the cell). Some of your thoughts are right, but you need to think that this signal its a pulsed DC, not AC, and it does not pass an arbitrary ground, so some transmission lines analysis may not apply.

In my wfc replications, the chokes must be equal, or the electromagnetic wave will not be cancelled and the scalar potential will not take over.
In the tesla magnifing transmitter he says that the electromagnetic radiation must me the lowest possible, so the scalar potentials can be transmitted. He used 2 coils too (primary and 2 other coils).
Try googling "scalar wave generation", you'll see that the most commom way to do it its like meyer did.

Edit: In tesla`s magnifier transmitter pattent, he stats that the ratio of coil lenghts must me lambda/4.

Thanks.

The gating of the PWM frequency is nothing more than a timing issue to do with gas production, it allows the gas to escape the magnetic or electric field and for 'the system to catch up' as Stan puts it. It will work without gating but the gas will not escape the confines of the fuel cell so easily. The step charging is top grade BS, all that step charging explains is how a capacitor naturally reaches catastrophic dielectric failure. Stan is living in cloud cuckoo land when he talks about elongated molecules and Electron behavior. How do I know? Because Stan never had equipment to claim such a notion be true of provable. It's one of his hypothesis and I'm beginning to think after seeing Tesla patents that most of his explanations are just waffle.
I'm not saying that Stan didn't achieve what is claimed, just that his explanations of how it all works are less than desirable.
Couple that together with the fact no one can produce satisfactory results and you have 1000's of people going down a tunnel with no light at the end of it.
Here are a few more facts while were at it:-
1. Frequency is not that important because Tesla got results with a set of rotary contact breakers.
2. Anyone who renames an inductor a resonant charging choke has something else in mind other than tank circuits and critical inductance levels.
3. Terms like resonant chokes crop up in radio talk a lot more than they do in electronics and are used to remove common mode currents from transmission lines and also to terminate electrical lengths in radiators.
4. Stan's explanation of his system working in sea water and not passing current across the capacitor came right out of the top draw of the BS cupboard. That is akin to saying you can take any conductor and create a capacitor anywhere you like along it without having a gap or a dielectric.

about Tesla works,flat pancake coil transmitter and receiver are the same length and size or called twins coils.but he used tesla coil(or high volt dc motor generator) to create high volts and high frequency then go to flat pancake transmitter coil.Tesla use iron wire,not copper wire because it will be a vapor.somethings like Meyer did=ss430fr wire.now i really agree with your thought.

11 vic units,which one is transmitter?which one is tesla coil(create high volts high frequency)?which one is receiver?

thanks,nav,root.locus.
geenee

Quote from geenee on June 11th, 2013, 07:49 PM

about Tesla works,flat pancake coil transmitter and receiver are the same length and size or called twins coils.but he used tesla coil(or high volt dc motor generator) to create high volts and high frequency then go to flat pancake transmitter coil.Tesla use iron wire,not copper wire because it will be a vapor.somethings like Meyer did=ss430fr wire.now i really agree with your thought.

11 vic units,which one is transmitter?which one is tesla coil(create high volts high frequency)?which one is receiver?

thanks,nav,root.locus.
geenee

Beardon comments that you must not kill the dipole geenee. By that he means that the electrical coil lengths and electrical wire lengths of both sides of the dipole MUST be equal. Tesla patents show this over and over again and even Stan uses a antenna type matching section on one of his resonant coils.
The dipole radiators are as follows:-
From the current blocking diode to the capacitor on the positive side.
From the position of the adjustable arm on the tuning coil to the capacitor on the negative isolated ground side.
Here is what I think is happening, not just in Meyer/Tesla circuits but in Bi-toroid transformers too. The Earth acts like a huge electrostatic capacitor with the ionosphere acting as one plate and the ground as the other plate. The cap is charged by various phenomenon such as the sun and weather conditions. When you see lightning that is a catastrophic breakdown of the dielectric layer.
Tesla realized IMHO that we have easy access to the ground side of a huge voltage potential and designed a dipole system to trap the positive side of the potential. He created the lower section of the dipole with an isolated ground, a coil and a cap plate. He then tuned the top half of his dipole to the bottom half with the exact same electrical lengths including the coil and the wiring.
He then stimulated the upper coil into life with pulsed dc so that it could receive omissions from the ionosphere via an electromagnetic coupling just like in a bi-toroidal transformer. Bi-toroidal transformers will not work unless you stimulate magnetic flux flow in the first place and prime them so to speak.
So in essence what we have is a dipole system that is capable of receiving cold electrostatic voltage from a huge capacitor into two inductance coils and then into a smaller capacitor. It's not rocket science, its the Earths natural voltage field captured on an antenna system.
 

Just a word of caution: None of this voltage that is captured is measurable with a multimeter or scope. Why? Because it is not based on the amps/volts/ohms system we have been bullPooted into using from school.
Don't try and measure it because you will get 0v.
The best way in any testing is to use either a fuel cell coupled to the cap or a bulb, we have no means of measuring cold electrostatic energy.

Quote from nav on June 12th, 2013, 09:17 AM

Just a word of caution: None of this voltage that is captured is measurable with a multimeter or scope. Why? Because it is not based on the amps/volts/ohms system we have been bullPooted into using from school.
Don't try and measure it because you will get 0v.
The best way in any testing is to use either a fuel cell coupled to the cap or a bulb, we have no means of measuring cold electrostatic energy.

Regardless, we do need some way to measure intensity for tuning purposes.  Do you think a neon or florescent tube would work?

I'm a bit concerned that a water cell may not have high enough resolution or respond rapidly enough to effectively tune the system.

Kind of a bugger to have a gut feeling something (radiant energy) could be there but not know how to tell if, when or how much.


And for those not following the thinking here, radiant energy has mass (has angular momentum) but is 2D and occupies no space.  It is not Matter.  Electrons are an arrangement of Bosons in a 3D object that are Matter and do occupy space/volume.  The two forms are completely different animals and equipment designed for measuring electrons and their flow are simply useless to measure radiant energy.  This is from the Tetryonics lectures which I highly recommend you find and study before jumping to any conclusions.

Quote from Dog-One on June 12th, 2013, 11:12 AM

Quote from nav on June 12th, 2013, 09:17 AM

Just a word of caution: None of this voltage that is captured is measurable with a multimeter or scope. Why? Because it is not based on the amps/volts/ohms system we have been bullPooted into using from school.
Don't try and measure it because you will get 0v.
The best way in any testing is to use either a fuel cell coupled to the cap or a bulb, we have no means of measuring cold electrostatic energy.

Regardless, we do need some way to measure intensity for tuning purposes.  Do you think a neon or florescent tube would work?

I'm a bit concerned that a water cell may not have high enough resolution or respond rapidly enough to effectively tune the system.

Kind of a bugger to have a gut feeling something (radiant energy) could be there but not know how to tell if, when or how much.

You could use a resistive load I suppose so a tube may work. We are talking about tapping into a sea of energy of incredible intensity but on a smaller scale. I have read that the electric fields and electromagnetic fields decrease as you move away from the ionosphere in layers. The field has resonance and your system is tapping into an harmonic of that resonance.

where does Steve Meyers instruction to solder a component to the heat sinc to set up a frequency fit into all this?

Quote from burnhydroxy on June 12th, 2013, 07:39 PM

where does Steve Meyers instruction to solder a component to the heat sinc to set up a frequency fit into all this?

Where did you see that?

Quote from nav on June 12th, 2013, 11:19 AM

Quote from Dog-One on June 12th, 2013, 11:12 AM

Quote from nav on June 12th, 2013, 09:17 AM

Just a word of caution: None of this voltage that is captured is measurable with a multimeter or scope. Why? Because it is not based on the amps/volts/ohms system we have been bullPooted into using from school.
Don't try and measure it because you will get 0v.
The best way in any testing is to use either a fuel cell coupled to the cap or a bulb, we have no means of measuring cold electrostatic energy.

Regardless, we do need some way to measure intensity for tuning purposes.  Do you think a neon or florescent tube would work?

I'm a bit concerned that a water cell may not have high enough resolution or respond rapidly enough to effectively tune the system.

Kind of a bugger to have a gut feeling something (radiant energy) could be there but not know how to tell if, when or how much.

You could use a resistive load I suppose so a tube may work. We are talking about tapping into a sea of energy of incredible intensity but on a smaller scale. I have read that the electric fields and electromagnetic fields decrease as you move away from the ionosphere in layers. The field has resonance and your system is tapping into an harmonic of that resonance.

measurement for cold energ -

in the lindemann video (tesla for dummies) he talked about experiments with cold energy from the 80s when they lighted bulbs in their hands connected to earth thru a human body without any physical excitations for the experimenter.

if that works the heating wire of a standard old vacuum tube might work and control another conventional current flow thru the vacuum tube. that way the filament driven by cold energy would produce a measurable change.

another way may be using a resistor bonded to a heat sensor and measure temperature.