#### freethisone

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #50, on September 22nd, 2014, 03:27 AM »
Quote from Matt Watts on June 7th, 2014, 03:11 PM
When I hear someone mention that phrase, I know what it means, but if you get into an argument with someone like Peter Lindemann or Aaron Murukami remind them that ALL systems are Open Loop because we have absolutely no control what goes on in those systems at the quantum level.  Which means zero point energy can (and does) enter the system at multiple locations.  ZPE interacts with everything--some places it adds energy and other places it takes it back.  In conventional systems, by definition ZPE is completely excluded, which is sorely incorrect.  Remember that and set folks straight who attempt to persuade you otherwise.
Hi i had been thinking about this question for a long time. it hit me. a sterling motor is as close as u can get to a closed loop system. in fluid dynamics i would say a pressure in a pipe can be influenced by heat or cold

you could say open. i want to take a fluid accelerate it, then have a pressure drop to make it go even faster. this is as close as it gets to a closed loop.

but i say Ford model T genrator, the one ed lee had used for his fly wheel could be considered a closed loop. in the world of pots and pan.
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #51, on September 30th, 2014, 02:20 PM »
new invention, so easy.

if you charge battery 12 volt or even 24 why are you spending money to charge them when you can charge em for free on your daily commute?

simply add your wind mill type generators inside the grill of your car, and charge them when u drive from point a to b? lol lcheers.

#### freethisone

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #53, on September 30th, 2014, 06:06 PM »

are you saying he placed a force on the side of the wheel in your direction, looking from the side, a tourque?

it needs to be spinning. true or false? he found a way to make wheel base wide enough to cause a wheel to spin, but the force applied needs to be re applied in his case. true or false?

#### ~Russ

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #54, on October 6th, 2014, 10:55 AM »
Quote from freethisone on August 11th, 2014, 04:04 PM
Wow  Russ talked to Joe..  did you tell him what we can do? or to visit this thread? cheers O:-)
i did not, although i did not have that much time ether, so packed in the small bits i could!

:)

~Russ

#### freethisone

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #55, on October 13th, 2014, 07:32 PM »Last edited on October 13th, 2014, 07:35 PM
Quote from ~Russ on October 6th, 2014, 10:55 AM
i did not, although i did not have that much time ether, so packed in the small bits i could!

:)

~Russ
What is the forum waiting for?    New invention by freethisone. invention free this one. read here for a brief outlook.

Now for my simple incorporation of a ultrasonic traducer in a fuel tank. take a transducer, put in a cup of gas. observe the effect. a vapour may appear, now pressurize it, and take a psi reading. does it increase.

I say yes.

does this alow me to add a half a cup of water to the mix? perhaps.

as for magnetic fluids, and geet reactors. as for tesla turbines. steam turbines to plasma fuel turbines new invention.

Its time russ you get a lawnmower and test these advancements. You were never about only stan myers. you tested other ideas.

need help simple work.

http://www.hho4free.com/bubblers.htm

Bubblers & Tanks

The process of Electrolyzing water has a minimum of two by-products, hydrogen and oxygen gases. As the gases are made, they rise to the top of the water - in the form of bubbles. The bubbling action on the surface can be quite turbulent. The turbulence can cause foam. The foam can collect on the waters surface and get carried or sucked into the engine. Is that a good thing or a bad thing? Well, a bubble is a gas trapped inside of a membrane. In our case, it is a water membrane. If you jump into a lake, you come out wet - right? Well the gases come out of the hydrogen generator wet. They are trapped inside a thin membrane of water. Some of the bubbles are big; some are small; some are in the form of mist; and under certain conditions, they are sometimes  in the form of steam (steam is not a bubble).
As long as the water is pure, the bubbles are not much of a problem for gasoline engines. Gasoline engines are always burning fuel mixed with water vapor in the air. They will even run while you pour water down their throat. Diesel engines are not like that. Water will not compress into vapor, inside the combustion chamber, thus it will lockup the piston and damage the engine. Water vapor however will compress so it is ok. Diesel engines burn water vapor all of the time; it comes from the air.

One by-product of burning gasoline and diesel fuel is also water. Both fuels are hydrocarbons. Some by-products of burning carbon are Carbon Dioxide and Carbon Monoxide. The only by-product of burning hydrogen is water. So while your engine does not burn water, it sure makes a lot of it, in the form of steam.

If our engines can handle water vapor, then what is the big deal about having a bubbler? For the most part, the problem is the other contents of the water. We add Electrolytes to the water - to increase gas production. Water is a very poor conductor of electricity - and the electrolytes change that for us, Chemically. It is the chemicals in the water that can be destructive to our engines. As the gases rise to the surface of the electrolyzer, they get trapped inside a water membrane. The membrane contains the chemicals that are in the water. The bubbles, and the mist contain traces of the chemicals, That contaminated moisture has the potential to cause harm to aluminum parts in our engines.

The bubbler's job, in most cases, is to get rid of any foam. It can also be used to rinse or wash the gases; in other words, get rid of the chemicals. A bubbler that contains electrolytes can not wash out or remove electrolytes. To do this, you will need a second bubbler which does not contain any electrolytes. I will cover this more, later.

Sometimes a bubbler is used as a Flash Arrestor; but not reliably. I have witnessed engine backfires that passed from the intake manifold, to the bubbler, through the water (from bubble to bubble) and out of the bubbler to the electrolyzer. The closer the bubbles are together, the better the chances for a flashback to make it through the water. HHO is an explosive gas. The explosion travels faster than a speeding bullet; over 3,000 feet per second. Don't trust a bubbler to stop a flashback.

Wet Cell - Water Bath Systems

Hydrogen generators that do not have sealed off water compartments, between each set of electrode plates or tubes, are considered water bath systems. In other words, water can flow or touch all parts of the plates; the bottoms, the tops, the sides. My tube cell is a prime example; or Joe Cell design as some want to call it, My tubes are submerged in a container of water. Water fills the tubes from the bottom and from the top (if I keep the water level up). I allow 4 to 5 inches of freeboard above the top of the tubes; freeboard is waterless head space. I use this area to dissipate the foam. By doing this, I do not need a bubbler; it is built in.
This is an excellent design for cold weather. If and when the water freezes, the generator can not produce hydrogen and oxygen. As soon as the water starts to thaw, the generator is safe to use. I only have one hose on the generator; it is at the top of the water free space, above the frozen water.

I could use a Bubbler as a Scrubber to wash or filter electrolytes from the gasses. But by doing so, I would risk the safety of a frozen generator. I do not have a problem with foam, so I choose not to use a bubbler.

If you use a stainless steel container with tubes, for your water bath system, you will not have to worry about your system breaking or cracking when it freezes. At most, it will just push the hose off of the lid. A tube stainless steel water bath system is by far the safest hydrogen generator. It is also the most expensive to build.

Dry Cell Systems

Hydrogen generators that have sealed off water compartments, between each set of electrode plates or tubes, are considered dry cell systems. In other words, water can not flow or touch all parts of the plates. The bottoms, the tops, the sides are all sealed off so that water can not get past them. Each set of plates forms a water tight compartment.
There is very little head space, if any. A lot of foam is produced and it has no place to accumulate, so it gets pushed or pulled out of the generator.

This system is going to need a Bubbler. The bubbler can also be used to re-supply water to the Dry Cell. That would make it both a bubbler and a tank. By installing the bubbler/tank above the Dry Cell, water will circulate and help cool the generator.

Another option would be to use a separate Tank to refill the Dry Cell, and use a Bubbler to wash/scrub the gases. If you do this, you loose the cooling circulation. If you want the circulation, then you will have to use a pump to keep the water circulating between the Tank and the generator. In order to use the Bubbler as a washer, the hose from the generator to the Bubbler needs to be- above the water line. It can then be extended below the surface of the water. If you connect that hose at the bottom of the bubbler, the water in the bubbler will mix with the water in the generator. The water in the generator contains electrolytes. The water in the bubbler does not.

A Dry Cell is disadvantaged when it comes to winter driving. The main reason is the Bubbler. If the water in the bubbler freezes, the water lines also freeze. The cell can not be operated safely until ALL of the lines thaw. If the generator thaws out before the water lines thaw, and you turn it on, the gases will build up pressure. If they can not find an escape rout, they can self ignite under pressure.

A Dry Cell System is the most efficient electrolyzer design. It is most popular built using flat plates, but it can be built using tubes.

C
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #56, on October 13th, 2014, 10:52 PM »Last edited on October 13th, 2014, 10:56 PM
comment on this, is it to easy that u wanna split water?  Why?  on top of all the info here i can turn the vapour to a fuel, or magnetic fluid, turned to a plasma, or modified as a fuel additive booster. ,
and only need to add a chemical. Name the element ? I am not crypic at all.

this concept works, see movie link.

chancing dreams are we? pushing the world forward?
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #57, on February 4th, 2015, 02:48 AM »
I want to point out that a practical idea is best.

were does oil come from?  have we been taught it came from the old dinosaurs?  fact is wood is the primary source. including peat moss.

as i had said before, the removal of oil from the earth will cause the earth magnetic field to collapse.
it is the oil in the transformer, without it energy will cross the gap. reason is due to electrical breakdown. lightning.

mr teselonian is the best source of continued Tesla works.  i support him on youtube,  be sure to build a gasifier and share it here.
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #58, on February 4th, 2015, 03:44 AM »
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #59, on February 5th, 2015, 08:27 AM »Last edited on February 5th, 2015, 06:40 PM

chain saw runs on wood,

If some of  you still use youtube Please  tell MR T for me ,that he can use the glow plug as a stand alone spark plug.
he wont even need the carburetor. according to Clyde White the founder of vaporous technology. circa 1119-1923

a galvanized pipe to the intake at up to 200 psi will work well.

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #60, on February 5th, 2015, 08:37 AM »Last edited on February 5th, 2015, 08:41 AM
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #61, on February 7th, 2015, 06:51 AM »Last edited on February 7th, 2015, 06:59 AM
Well people? i am speechless , Mr T  proving that smoke alone can be a fuel. as a simple 100 year old concept is seen reproduced here by MrTesa O:-)lonian.

the carbon bonds in the smoke, and water vapor releases enough energy to ignite as a fuel. do you remember me saying this?

smoke from carbon atoms break bonds under heat , and pressure.
introduce superheated steam. H O2

wow! lol interesting thoughts! ~Russ

total nut case, but it turns out

Now we are ready to modernize fuel systems all over the world, in any number of ways,
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #62, on February 7th, 2015, 10:48 PM »Last edited on February 7th, 2015, 10:52 PM

its funny how this guy said its a vapor carb, and it doesn't do amazing things.  ??? what?. it does do amazing things, it burns fuel closer to 100  percent combustion. increased mileage.  does it really create a plasma to? that sounds reasonable. the hotter the reactor gets, the bluer the flame will be. water is a great free added addition to the mix. superheated steam is known for burning as a browns gas.

a Tesla turbine could make  a better reactor. it gets very hot.

Basically this guy does not know what he is talking about. we are simply burning fuel to a 100 % rather then wasting it as unburned carbon out the tail pipe.  I would enter this challenge in a minute. to prove A vapor is ideal.

#### Cycle

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #63, on February 8th, 2015, 04:43 PM »
Quote from phil on March 21st, 2013, 02:52 PM
As far as fuel savings go of the engines ive modified myself, ive seen 80% drop in emissions, even if the car is already running clean. One of my pals reckons he's saved between £500 and £1000 this year on fuel.
I understand that the GadgetMan Groove helps just-off-idle and low-throttle engine economy by leaning the fuel mix via turbulence... but how well would it work for a small scooter engine that's often run at WOT (Wide Open Throttle)?

Would it have any effect, or just an effect during partial-throttle riding?

#### Matt Watts

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #64, on February 8th, 2015, 06:08 PM »
Quote from Cycle on February 8th, 2015, 04:43 PM
I understand that the GadgetMan Groove helps just-off-idle and low-throttle engine economy by leaning the fuel mix via turbulence... but how well would it work for a small scooter engine that's often run at WOT (Wide Open Throttle)?

Would it have any effect, or just an effect during partial-throttle riding?
You know, that gives me an idea...

How about multiple staged GadgetMan Groove venturis that are feed via super charger.  The whole idea of that device is to create the extreme pressure differential which breaks the molecular bonds of the fuel.  If engineered properly, it would work for the entire load range of the engine.

#### freethisone

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #65, on February 9th, 2015, 04:15 PM »Last edited on February 9th, 2015, 04:18 PM
Matt  you have it all wrong, its about pressure and heat yes but to make the fuel into a light gas so combustion is complete. adding air is not how you would do that. adding an hcat system as a catalyst is. or adding the steam to a Tesla turbine to become super heated.

in the vapure from a ultrasonic transducer, or a steam chamber, Or by ionizing the gas with ions. or light. or any other means we have at our disposal. carbon atoms, and HHO together.. incorporation of these ideas are very possible, and practical.
that is were our energy is hidden.

#### Matt Watts

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #66, on February 9th, 2015, 05:01 PM »
The reason for the GadgetMan Groove and the problem with modern day pump fuels, is they add polymers to the fuel specifically so it won't burn; they do it in such a way it doesn't show up in an octane or cetane test too.  They have gotten so good at this method you can no longer superheat the fuel to break down those polymers.

A modern automobile is more than capable of 100 MPG, that's not the problem.  The fuel is the problem.  Engineers at the automotive manufactures along with chemists at the petroleum plants work hand-in-hand to sell more fuel and more cars.  They practically revealed this when everything became fuel injected, but nobody (or very few) noticed.

Put simply, the gasoline you buy at the pump is pure waste product, hazardous waste.  The petroleum folks know this; they also know if people still had a few brain cells to rub together, they would charge the petroleum folks mucho dollars for disposing of this hazardous waste instead of paying for it.  It's a huge scam, much like fluoride.

There's a guy on another forum, goes by the handle of centraflow that has been working on various methods to produce synthetic carbon based fuel; the process is very similar to making HHO.  With his fuel and a reworked aspirated fuel system, an automobile can easily do 100 MPG.  All of this without ever sticking a pipe in the ground.  Oh, and the emissions from this...  It won't pass inspection because the testers are told there is an acceptable range; you go above or BELOW this range and you fail.  No more driving.  It's just like George Carlin said, "They've got you by the balls."  Heads they win, tails you lose.

My point is, you can't beat the system.  You can however ignore it, but everybody has go along.  You go it alone and you're toast.

So yeah Free, I know where you're coming from.  It's like preaching to a wall, people hear you, but they don't seem to listen.  Or at least they don't seem to take any positive action in the right direction.  I don't know what everyone is waiting for.  Maybe for the sun to set and never come back up.  Zombie apocalypse seems to fit pretty close.  I guess we just sit back and watch the train wreck.  I'm not sure what else we can do.

#### Gunther Rattay

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #67, on February 10th, 2015, 03:07 AM »
Quote from Matt Watts on February 9th, 2015, 05:01 PM
...
So yeah Free, I know where you're coming from.  It's like preaching to a wall, people hear you, but they don't seem to listen.  Or at least they don't seem to take any positive action in the right direction.  I don't know what everyone is waiting for.  Maybe for the sun to set and never come back up.  Zombie apocalypse seems to fit pretty close.  I guess we just sit back and watch the train wreck.  I'm not sure what else we can do.
Quite clear what we have to to: we have to create results here in the forum.

these results must be useful, an alternative for standard technology.
why are there so few results up now?
because it´s complex, more than a single individual can do. something a company can do.
how can we overcome the lack of competence, time and money?
by cooperation.
why is there so little cooperation? because it´s difficult to cooperate for some time over a distance.
for cooperation roles must be defined and there must be progress control.

why are activities going in circles over and over again? beacuse it´s easier to start from scratch over and over again than starting from a milestone position already reached.

maybe these forums are for technical entertainment more than for serios progress ...
who can tell me being wrong?

please ... some good points that give me back some hope ...

#### Sulaiman

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #68, on February 10th, 2015, 11:05 AM »
my hope is that someone will report a previously unnoticed anomaly
then we can all pile in and investigate it.

other than that I have little hope of an over-unity device .... but I live in hope !

#### nav

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #69, on February 10th, 2015, 01:48 PM »
Quote
please ... some good points that give me back some hope ...
Three points............
1. An inductor will try to self resonate no matter the circumstances. It is our poor networks that stop most self resonance.
2. When self resonance takes place in an inductor, if the network will allow it, voltage will expotentially double on every oscillation and never stop till it reaches the edge of the Universe or a finite level caused by the network, which ever comes first.
3. These things are sent to test us, test our resolve, test our application skills and our integrity. Did Tesla fall at the first hurdle when faced with a problem 100 years ago when he was working with materials far less advanced than what we work with now? No he did not and neither will you.
Head up, chest out and fight on.
##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #70, on February 11th, 2015, 03:12 AM »
Quote
other than that I have little hope of an over-unity device .
Submissive, defeatist and pessimistic viewpoint. You kinda remind me of the guy that said we would suffocate at speeds above 25mph.
I've just read your post about you being some sort of Uni dean, rather interesting. Seeing as you seem to be in the know about Electricity and Electrons I would like to ask you an interesting question:-
Electrons seem to be playing a huge roll in what we can and cannot achieve in our circuitry to date, I would like to ask you - what roll a human being has in influencing the way an Electron flows in a conductor. Do you think an Electron could act in one particular way when we are not looking then act in a different way once we start observing it? As if the Electron knows we are watching it?

#### Sulaiman

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #71, on February 11th, 2015, 08:20 AM »Last edited on February 11th, 2015, 09:21 AM by Sulaiman
the entire line;
"other than that I have little hope of an over-unity device .... but I live in hope !"
that's not defeatism, just realism followed by optimism.
...
The electron ..... what a mystery!

is it a particle? yes,if you look for a particle
is it a wave? ...yes, if you look for a wave

apparently we can know either it's position or its velocity, but not both at the same time (Heisenberg etc.)

to the limit of my knowledge, 'looking' at an electron causes it to behave differently than if we didn't look.

I know that images of atoms have been made, but I'm not aware of any image of an electron
so technically, AFAIK, we are at present unable to 'look' at an individual electron.
...
I've spent most of my life doing 'electron'ics and I have thought and read about the electron ... but I'm none the wiser.
(it took me years to realise how slowly they travel in a wire, for example)
Luckily for engineering we don't care, we just take the average behaviour of lots of them
(e.g. 1 Amp = 6,241,509,340,000,000,000 electrons per second passing by)(+/- some)

Similarly, when we look at a voltage or current we have to take some energy,
even though in engineering terms it is 'negligible' , to get a reading
so in any electrical circuit, 'looking' disturbs the behaviour.

on the other hand,
I doubt that individual electrons have the psychic ability to know when we are watching them :D

Back to the defeatism/realism/optimism thing.
If you think about it, there can be no true 'over-unity' device .....
the energy must come from somewhere and go somewhere,
it may be ZPE/quantum vacuum/dark energy ...... who knows ?
A lump of Radium is an over-unity device, until you take nuclear/quantum physics into account,
(i.e. the radium will not self-regenerate)
so what we are really looking for is a presently unknown source of energy that can be utilised.

In my philosophy (Islam) this whole universe, even what we call time, is a subset of 'true' reality,
so I have no problem believing that there are as yet unknown sources of energy for us to discover.
I am however concerned about what use such discoveries will be put to, our track record isn't that good.
(e.g. which came first, environmentally clean nuclear power stations, or a more efficient method of mass murder?)
(I'm not implying that nuclear power is environmentally clean,
on the contrary, we deliberately made 'dirty' nuclear power so that we can make our weapons)
So yes, there is an element of pessimism mixed in with my optimism.

nav, if/when you get your bifilar water splitter to work,
would you expect most of the R&D to be,
in the commercial sector for us all to get free clean energy,
or in the military application of it?
(worth considering?)

#### nav

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #72, on February 11th, 2015, 09:07 AM »
So you will admit that placing an amp meter in line with a load is influencing the plight of the Electron?

#### Sulaiman

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #73, on February 11th, 2015, 09:23 AM »Last edited on February 11th, 2015, 09:37 AM by Sulaiman
Absolutely, yes!

an ammeter adds resistance to the circuit,
causing some voltage to be lost across it,
and power dissipated in it.

again, if we make an ammeter that takes 'negligible' energy from the circuit (e.g. a Hall-effect probe)
then for engineering purposes we can ignore the disturbance,
once measuring devices cause errors less than the 'noise' of the system being measured,
for engineering purposes it is 'negligible'

#### nav

##### Re: Electric vaporizer 90 mpg
« Reply #74, on February 11th, 2015, 09:35 AM »
Quote from Sulaiman on February 11th, 2015, 09:23 AM
Absolutely, yes!

an ammeter adds resistance to the circuit,
causing some voltage to be lost across it,
and power dissipated in it.
But is the amp meter capable of collapsing the wave function?