Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment

ayeaye


Matt Watts

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #1,  »
It's here now.  I'll have to look at it carefully and understand fully what you have going on before I can comment.

First look troubles me a bit with those waveforms--very difficult to get accurate power measurements.

ayeaye

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #2,  »
Thanks a lot.

Yes the way i calculated, drawing the graphs with a vector graphics editor, is not the most accurate, though it may be accurate enough. I have an analog scope, so the picture of the oscilloscope screen is all i get. But if one has a digital oscilloscope, then i think it's possible to get the waveform data from it in some format, and then do the calculations with a python script in a similar way than i did. This python script will likely be as simple, no matter whether the data is in the vector form or sample form.

I once thought to try to replicate it using a $13 dso138 scope, so that everyone can replicate that experiment, this may be possible though i'm not certain, this thing certainly distorts a lot. But now it seems that it may be rather replicated using some rigol scopes.

I have an old hitachi 20 mhz scope, i thoroughly calibrated it and all, and it is a good and precise instrument, but it also has places burned in on the screen, so i cannot even always move the trace to the grid line.

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #3,  »Last edited
Quote from Matt Watts on September 13th, 10:05 AM
First look troubles me a bit with those waveforms--very difficult to get accurate power measurements.
Waveforms are complicated right, this needs a very high precision. Indeed anything less than a digital oscilloscope might not be precise enough. Reading a waveform data, and do calculations from this. But doing it with a digital oscilloscope like that will certainly be precise enough.

Rigol should give waveform data for every channel, is it 600 samples for the screen, each sample one byte. It's quite easy to modify the python script for that, 3 lists are necessary, and gety() should just return y.

Then the error range might be calculated. Say like the oscilloscope could make a mistake one pixel up or down, then calculate with the worst and best values, and see whether the possible overunity is still in that range. Enough i think, voltage on R2 and R3 during the input part greater by one pixel, is there still overunity.

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #4,  »Last edited
Sorry, i use it here more like my blog. I did it with gschem. I think this should be done with Inkscape, when a copy of the oscilloscope screen needs to be drawn. Precision is everything there. I tried to draw it with Inkscape, but had some trouble, the ends of the lines on the picture of the oscilloscope screen are blurry, where they supposed to begin and end? Python script can be written to read data from svg file, there, input, output and channel 2 are all 3 separate paths. But i have not done it yet. So by now there is only a script for gschem. And all that trouble is for using analog scope, from digital scope waveform data can be obtained, and the python script needs only a slight change to calculate based on the waveform data instead. Is anything bout digital scope accurate enough for this thing? Never had to think about it, but i have no digital scope.

If someone happens to replicate this experiment with a digital scope, send the waveform data to me, then i will modify the python scipt, so it can calculate from that. Better to measure, measure everything.

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #5,  »
I now wrote a Python screen for extracting data from an Inkscape file in my overunity forum thread above, and tried using it with Inkscape, using Inkscape for that is absolutely the best and sufficiently accurate. All the rest, like the picture of the oscilloscope matters, but as i said the accuracy can be estimated.